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Seeking "All Mountain" "CARVING" skis - Page 3

post #61 of 82

Sorry about the missing info..

 

Head Supershape Magnum

 

Radius 13.5 @ 170
Sidecut

121/71/107 @ 170

 

Head Supershape, Titan is 80 under foot and about 14.5 M radius IIRC

post #62 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogsie View Post

I have the 88xti 178 and find it really fun to carve!


I have been thinking about a more carving front side biased ski for awhile now, as my Dynastar Sultan 85's really are not inspiring me anymore.  I have read a lot about this ski and like what I have read.  I can never demo, but have wanted a pair of Elan skis for the last 2 seasons, so if I can find a pair of 178's at a great price, I may just buy a pair for next season.  I couldn't find anything that spoke about how stiff they are, but with two sheets of titanal in them, I will likely be glad I have the weight to bend them.  It would be nice if the tips were not to stiff though, as I need all the help I can get skiing moguls.  Any comments on the tip to tail stiffness?

post #63 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by liv2 ski View Post


I have been thinking about a more carving front side biased ski for awhile now, as my Dynastar Sultan 85's really are not inspiring me anymore.  I have read a lot about this ski and like what I have read.  I can never demo, but have wanted a pair of Elan skis for the last 2 seasons, so if I can find a pair of 178's at a great price, I may just buy a pair for next season.  I couldn't find anything that spoke about how stiff they are, but with two sheets of titanal in them, I will likely be glad I have the weight to bend them.  It would be nice if the tips were not to stiff though, as I need all the help I can get skiing moguls.  Any comments on the tip to tail stiffness?

First of all, I don't think there is 2 sheets of titanium but one... On their site XTI means:

"Special light construction for high performance wide platform skis. One layer of titanium enhances edge control while longitudinal carbon fibers provide responsiveness and smooth transition in turns which is needed in wider skis."

http://www.elanskis.com/us/technology/reinforcement.html#xti

 

 I do own a sultan legend 85 (178) ( now for sale) so I'll compare the 2...

If you want more infos, you could tell me what skis you tried and I could go from there if I know them too...

 

The 88xti are more stiff that the sultan85 from tip to tail... So that is why they are better at carving and have a nice pop at the end of the turns... But at the same time, they are nor too stiff... In fact, I was amazed at the performances of the 88 because I tought that the ski was not really stiff so I was not expecting that kind of performance... So...

for carving, 88 is 500% more fun than the sultan85

for crud, the 85 is better but the 88 is nice too

for steep, the 88 is better

edge grip, 88 is nicer

for bumps and trees, in terms of flex: 85 is better but because of the fluid system, the 85 is slower and heavier; the 88 is stiffer but also livier and lighter...

 

Like I said earlier, my 88xti were bought flat (no system)

post #64 of 82

^^^^Thanks for that.  I found a pair for $599 with the Elan Binding system, so I will be selling my Sultan 85's down the road. I hope they live up to your comments.

for carving, 88 is 500% more fun than the sultan85eek.gif

for crud, the 85 is better but the 88 is nice too (i can live with that)

for steep, the 88 is better  (Sweet, exactly what I hoped for)

edge grip, 88 is nicer  (winner winner chicken dinner)

post #65 of 82

To clarify, none of these skis has 'titanium' in them.. They have 'Titanal', which is a trade name of a proprietary aluminum alloy from Austria Metall AG.

post #66 of 82
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by liv2 ski View Post

^^^^Thanks for that.  I found a pair for $599 with the Elan Binding system, so I will be selling my Sultan 85's down the road. I hope they live up to your comments.
for carving, 88 is 500% more fun than the sultan85:eek
for crud, the 85 is better but the 88 is nice too (i can live with that)
for steep, the 88 is better  (Sweet, exactly what I hoped for)
edge grip, 88 is nicer  (winner winner chicken dinner)

The edge grip on the 88s is obscene. Only ski I ever rode where I felt as though I was "slicing" the runs.
post #67 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by liv2 ski View Post

^^^^Thanks for that.  I found a pair for $599 with the Elan Binding system, so I will be selling my Sultan 85's down the road. I hope they live up to your comments.

for carving, 88 is 500% more fun than the sultan85eek.gif

for crud, the 85 is better but the 88 is nice too (i can live with that)

for steep, the 88 is better  (Sweet, exactly what I hoped for)

edge grip, 88 is nicer  (winner winner chicken dinner)

Wich lenght?

With the system? Then I can't no longer garanty the performance... wink.gif It should not be to big a difference...

At that point, it will depend of the skier...ski.gif

No but seriously, you will have fun big time on these...come back to me for comments when you try them!

Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

To clarify, none of these skis has 'titanium' in them.. They have 'Titanal', which is a trade name of a proprietary aluminum alloy from Austria Metall AG.

right...always get mixed up...

titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,

titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal! There! I've got it! Titanium!!! Oups! You see!

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lateskier2012 View Post


The edge grip on the 88s is obscene. Only ski I ever rode where I felt as though I was "slicing" the runs.

It is amazing for a 88mm ski! Remind me of my Avenger 82 ti that I bought 2 years ago after having demoing almost all the skis of that year... Even demoed it in 177 and 170 and choose the 170 because of the icegrip. the grip of the 177 was ordinary...

post #68 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogsie View Post

Wich lenght?

With the system? Then I can't no longer garanty the performance... wink.gif It should not be to big a difference...

Over the weekend I ordered them here:  http://www.bobwards.com/ELAN-Mens-Amphibio-Waveflex-88-XTI-Fusion-120-Ski-and-Binding-System-2012-2013-92678

Just went there to get the address for you and now they are at $875???

What the hell is that all about?

Anyways, they did charge my credit card the $599, so I hope they ship them to me in a 178.

post #69 of 82

I was favorably impressed with the K2 Aftershock & Richtor,  but neither were the skis for me.  They may be for you.

 

Agree that the Chams in 97 were not at all "carvy" - yes, I could rail a turn if i tried hard enough, but it takes a bit of input to do it.  My soft snow skis are the Legend Sultan 85 (sadly discontinued) and they are much more carvy than the Cham.  So are this year's replacements for the Legends, the Outland - these would be worth trying as they meet your criteria, at least on paper. That said, nothing compares to my Course TI's (a dedicated hard snow carver that really really wants to carve all the time) - but you're not looking for that right now. 

 

The Volkl RTM is worth a spin - it's more biased towards groomed than the Kendo/Mantra.  It may replace the Legends when the time comes.  The Kendo/Mantra are beefy demanding skis that require you to drive them with authority all the time - no milking it with these skis.  My take was that the Kendo was no more forgiving or more "carvy" than the Mantra so if you're inclined that way just get the real thing (ie the Mantra)

post #70 of 82

Yes, the Volkl RTM is worth a look. I took the RTM 84 for a demo ride, now I'm thinking about it for next season. It is definitely not what I would think of as a carving ski, in terms of being energetic with "pop" out of the turn. The RTM 84 is fully rockered and feels glued to the snow, with a secure, stable ride that soaks up rough terrain. That "planted" feeling can make it somewhat boring on the groomed runs, if you are expecting typical carver performance. But the stability makes skiing fast a breeze, it never gets that "squirmy" feeling that a dedicated carver can exhibit at speed. I was surprised by this ski as it's not your typical Volkl, it doesn't demand your constant attention like most Volkl skis of past years. 

post #71 of 82
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogsie View Post

Wich lenght?

With the system? Then I can't no longer garanty the performance... wink.gif It should not be to big a difference...

At that point, it will depend of the skier...ski.gif

No but seriously, you will have fun big time on these...come back to me for comments when you try them!

right...always get mixed up...

titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,

titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal,titanal! There! I've got it! Titanium!!! Oups! You see!

 

 

It is amazing for a 88mm ski! Remind me of my Avenger 82 ti that I bought 2 years ago after having demoing almost all the skis of that year... Even demoed it in 177 and 170 and choose the 170 because of the icegrip. the grip of the 177 was ordinary...

 

What? I thought titanal was technology borrowed from the adult film industry . . . 

post #72 of 82
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post

I was favorably impressed with the K2 Aftershock & Richtor,  but neither were the skis for me.  They may be for you.

 

Agree that the Chams in 97 were not at all "carvy" - yes, I could rail a turn if i tried hard enough, but it takes a bit of input to do it.  My soft snow skis are the Legend Sultan 85 (sadly discontinued) and they are much more carvy than the Cham.  So are this year's replacements for the Legends, the Outland - these would be worth trying as they meet your criteria, at least on paper. That said, nothing compares to my Course TI's (a dedicated hard snow carver that really really wants to carve all the time) - but you're not looking for that right now. 

 

The Volkl RTM is worth a spin - it's more biased towards groomed than the Kendo/Mantra.  It may replace the Legends when the time comes.  The Kendo/Mantra are beefy demanding skis that require you to drive them with authority all the time - no milking it with these skis.  My take was that the Kendo was no more forgiving or more "carvy" than the Mantra so if you're inclined that way just get the real thing (ie the Mantra)

I will try the K2s as they, especially the Richtor, are very popular in the PNW. Friends who ride/rode Volkls described them the same way you did: lots off work if one does not have a hard charging style. That is me. Also,I don't think the RTM with its legendary carving stiffness would work well off-piste. I've never seen anyone skiing off-piste with RTMs. What I do see are really good "old guys" skiing K2 Apaches everywhere on the hill.

post #73 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post

.  My take was that the Kendo was no more forgiving or more "carvy" than the Mantra so if you're inclined that way just get the real thing (ie the Mantra)

 

I found the Kendo to be much quicker edge-to-edge than the Mantra, and just as planted. As always, YMMV.

post #74 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by liv2 ski View Post

Over the weekend I ordered them here:  http://www.bobwards.com/ELAN-Mens-Amphibio-Waveflex-88-XTI-Fusion-120-Ski-and-Binding-System-2012-2013-92678

Just went there to get the address for you and now they are at $875???

What the hell is that all about?

Anyways, they did charge my credit card the $599, so I hope they ship them to me in a 178.

Humm... maybe its a new way of doing business... Or when they saw my comments, they decided to raise the price???biggrin.gif

Here's a picture of mine with the Look bindings...

 

I don't have children so I show pictures of my skis...biggrin.gif

post #75 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post

I was favorably impressed with the K2 Aftershock & Richtor,  but neither were the skis for me.  They may be for you.

 

Agree that the Chams in 97 were not at all "carvy" - yes, I could rail a turn if i tried hard enough, but it takes a bit of input to do it.  My soft snow skis are the Legend Sultan 85 (sadly discontinued) and they are much more carvy than the Cham.  So are this year's replacements for the Legends, the Outland - these would be worth trying as they meet your criteria, at least on paper. That said, nothing compares to my Course TI's (a dedicated hard snow carver that really really wants to carve all the time) - but you're not looking for that right now. 

 

The Volkl RTM is worth a spin - it's more biased towards groomed than the Kendo/Mantra.  It may replace the Legends when the time comes.  The Kendo/Mantra are beefy demanding skis that require you to drive them with authority all the time - no milking it with these skis.  My take was that the Kendo was no more forgiving or more "carvy" than the Mantra so if you're inclined that way just get the real thing (ie the Mantra)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gimmesnow View Post

Yes, the Volkl RTM is worth a look. I took the RTM 84 for a demo ride, now I'm thinking about it for next season. It is definitely not what I would think of as a carving ski, in terms of being energetic with "pop" out of the turn. The RTM 84 is fully rockered and feels glued to the snow, with a secure, stable ride that soaks up rough terrain. That "planted" feeling can make it somewhat boring on the groomed runs, if you are expecting typical carver performance. But the stability makes skiing fast a breeze, it never gets that "squirmy" feeling that a dedicated carver can exhibit at speed. I was surprised by this ski as it's not your typical Volkl, it doesn't demand your constant attention like most Volkl skis of past years. 

That is why there are persons like myself who are willing to sell there Sultan85 to share the joy...

http://www.epicski.com/t/119834/dynastar-sultan-legend-85-fluid-178-cm#post_1573133

post #76 of 82
 

Originally Posted by lateskier2012 View Post

What? I thought titanal was technology borrowed from the adult film industry . . .

 

 

ROTF.gif

post #77 of 82
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogsie View Post

Humm... maybe its a new way of doing business... Or when they saw my comments, they decided to raise the price???biggrin.gif
Here's a picture of mine with the Look bindings...



I don't have children so I show pictures of my skis...biggrin.gif

Hmmmm. Late season snow, perhaps. Look for the price drop in 2-3 weeks. wink.gif
post #78 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by lateskier2012 View Post

I don't see many Elan skis over here in Seattle: I saw three pair on Crystal Mountain this year. The Amphibio line seems to get quite a bit of press. I'll have to do some homework to determine who demos them. Thanks.

Contact Elan for the rep's contact info and or a local dealer. The rep' is a PNW home grown and good bloke. New to the brand but plenty savy and a long time industry pro. I met and talked with him at a demo a few weeks ago. The Amphibio line has some solid models and well reviewed - high marks pretty much all around. Good luck...

post #79 of 82

"All Mountain" depends a lot on which mountain but Crystal has plenty of neat and extreme stuff - yay THAT! Somebody replied something about Nordica Supercharger boots. I'm familiar with the Supercharger ski and I actually own its predecessor - The Beast (or more formally Beast92). The beast is what I call a mid fat (124-92-118) and I use it for snow up to 2' and packed pow at any of the local mts (Copper, Breck-, Keystone, Vail and backcountry (really sidecountry - mostly Loveland Pass - which I love).

My very favorite ski is the Icelantic Shaman - it looks like a snow shovel, it totally floats pow and, to my utter amazement, it will actually carve quite well on packer and groomers. Awesome ski. I usually keep some race skis in my kit but my Atomic slaloms got busted up when some Ahole busted me up (near fatally actually) at ABasin (sigh). No racing ski is really suitable as an All Mountain ride - that's why so many of us have so many skis.

Lots of skis cost LOTS of money - so here's a tip: Consignment skis, i.e. USED skis. I've got my favorite shops in and around Frisco, CO but I've gotten total steals at THRIFT shops in various cities - Seattle will have plenty of both. I like to patronize thrift shops that support my favorite charities - especially ARC. Oh yeah - that steal  I mentioned was $1.50 for skis that were selling for $150 in a local consignment shop. I later got 2 more pairs of the same model for $10 at the local Senior Auction and $50 at a ski shop in Denver (this was a present for my daughter).

That's enough for now, I have to go figure out what to do on a non-Ski day - - too many damn tourists on the hill during holiday weeks.

Over and Out

Luke

p.s. by NYrs day many of those who got new skis for Xmas will have donated or consigned the OLD ones. Yay that.

post #80 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Matta View Post
 

honestly if you could not make the Extreme's carve a better ski is not going to help you. The PE/extreme while not stiff or particular grippy where pretty damn easy to carve even on eastern hardpack.

 

Once you learn to be pateint, tip and balance. basically any ski will carve unless the surface is stupid hard. And if it stupid hard more to do with the Tune/ski than the skier.

 

If your looking to improve your 'carving" game a ski like a 179cm Blizzard 8.0 CA or a 177cm Head Supershape Maguam will be help learn what you need to learn.

 

I own 8.5 Ti and its great all around ski but IMO its not an awesome groomer skis unless you on full edge locked carves. The tail rocker acts very funny is scratchy groomer conditions making anything but high edge angle snappy medium turns not that fun.  The e88 carves very well but does not WOW me.

 

The Brahma is what the Blizzard rep are calling the kendo killer. Its better all around than many skis including the 8.5ti. The biggest thing for me is the 181cm 8.5ti was a bear in the bumps, where as the 174 is great but lack stability, the 180cm Brahma is pretty good in the bumps but gains a huge steep in stability over either the 174 or 181 8.5 tis.

 Have you been skiing the Brahma much this season? Im liking the reviews but wonder about powder with these skis for me at 225lbs? I may just go with the Bonified. I havent found to many skis ski better than that in all conditions for me. I demoed the 173 Bone and was blown away!! Clocked 60mph,great on groomed and in bumps. Crud I could just bob,weave and crush at any speed. Is the Brahma like this also? The 2014 Stormrider 100 seems pretty interesting to me also.

post #81 of 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by lateskier2012 View Post


Hmmmm. Late season snow, perhaps. Look for the price drop in 2-3 weeks. wink.gif

So, what skis did you buy?

post #82 of 82
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogsie View Post
 

So, what skis did you buy?

Bought FX 94s from Dawg. Have not skied them as the conditions here in the PNW are more hospitable to rock skis. Thinking more about Elan 88XTI or Kastle MX 83 for true carving since I believe the FXs will do well as all mountain skis, but fair for carving.

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