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Help me narrow down some demo options please

post #1 of 37
Thread Starter 
Hi everyone,

I just found this forum and it looks like what I've been searching for. I'm an ex racer from college, ex ski instructor from PA and CO. I've been on skis since I was around 3 yrs old, but had given up the sport for the last 5-6 years. I have gotten back into it this winter and forgot what I was missing all those years. Anyway, I purchased new boots recently because I'm getting older (31) and can't handle squeezing into race boots (Nordica Grand Prix 90's) 1.5 sizes too small and skiing all day. I found the Nordica Waves to fit me well and provide enough performance and lots of comfort.

Now I'm onto new skis. My Rossi 7S 205 race boards just don't cut it here in PA, they were fun in Co, but not here. I'll still keep them for those real icey high speed runs, but frankly, they are kicking my butt in the bumps due to their length and the limited sweet spot. I'm not 21 anymore and can't just go throw those boards around all day [img]smile.gif[/img]

I'm looking to demo the following on a trip to Snowshoe in a few weeks, looking for suggestions on these or others:

Volkl Vertigo (G3 perhaps?)
Volkl Super Sport 4
Volkl P50 Platinum

Atomic C8, C9
Atomic R8, R9

K2 Axis

Nordicas are also available to demo...any ideas?

I'm 6-2 210, love race inspired boards [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] , but need a bit more forgiveness to ski the bumps anymore. I ski it all, pow (like we get it here), crud, steeps, trees, bumps...I need some good recs for an all mountain board that will still hold well on the patented PA ice (which is just about every day) I'm likely going to look into the 180-182 length. Thanks for any insight you can give since I've been totally out of the ski scene basically since parabolics came out.
post #2 of 37
The skis you mention would all be good choice with the G3 probably the most useful of the bunch. It's harder to find a bad ski in todays market than it is to find a good, so demo as much as you can and I'm sure something will jump up and grab you.

As for the boots, I had the same GP's you do and loved them. I've also had every model of GP until they came out with the Doberman. If the Nordica fit is what works for you, then try some Dobermans. They make a bunch of different flexes in the boot ranging from the 160 WC down a much softer flex for women and lighter skiers. Any good boot shop will be able to find the right one for you.

That GP 90 CK was/is a sweet boot!
post #3 of 37
Thread Starter 
Anything else out there that is a "must try"?
post #4 of 37
What about Rossi Bandit XXs?
I've never been on them, but I have skied with others who like them, and if you ask very nicely, you might be able to persuade oboe to talk about his

post #5 of 37
Just my 2 Euro cent ......

I think the Atomics further up the range would suit you better (eg 11.20 or the R:EX if you require greater width/more float).

post #6 of 37
You may want to consider the Rossignol Bandit XX, which is a great all around ski - very versatile, good edge bite on hard snow, plows though deeper snow and junk, great short turner and quick edge to edge, great GS turner. Considering your weight, your racing background, and the requirements you've presented, this could serve you well in the proper length. However, also because of those very requirements, and particularly the ice, the Rossignol RPM 21 might be better - it's basically the Bandit XX with a plate. Still, the XX is more versatile.

Another great all around model is the Dynastar Intuitiv 71 - very solid for you in the longer length - an extremely forgiving ski, which maybe you don't need. The Dynastar Intuitiv 74, however, is not as good a ski. It's somewhat like the Bandit XX, but not as solid.

Since you're getting back into skiing after a hiatus, it may also be worthwhile to check out some equipment reviews. One of the best places to start that is right here on EpicSki. Go to the home page, and click on Gear Info. The reviews section will take you to Peter Keelty's web site, called Technical Support for Skiers, one of the best best places to read about skis. Another good place is in Ski Presse magazine, which you can pick up for free, or else go to their web site.

Best of all, if you can demo skis, it will be an education, especially for someone who's been out of the market for awhile - it's a new order and a new day! If you demo, in addition to the above, please consider the K2 Axis XP. You've mentioned the K2 Axis [no X or anything], and while it's a very good model, it may be less than what you like and not a favorite of mine for ice. But the XP is to be tasted! Very solid, bulls though anything smoothly like a tank but feels like a Cadillac - but not the ski for short turns or edge to edge quickness, unlike the Bandit XX! Still . . . try it if you can!

Good luck in your hunt, and please let us know what you settle on!
post #7 of 37
I would first say you are considering too long a ski. I grew up in western Pennsylvania, however, haven't been there in thirty years. Knowing what I do about Seven Springs I would ski a 160 cm short slalom.

Atomic SL9
Fischer WC SC
Elan SLX
Fischer Sceneo 500
post #8 of 37
Well i had a lovely post all set here and then i hit the back button on the browser and lost it... so here goes again:

Rusty guy has a great point. I ski in Western NY at Greek Peak, Kissing Bridge, Holiday Valley, and soon Holimont as well. The skis that i have free skied on all season are my Elan SLX's. I have three pairs of them; two of them are for free skiing and training, the other is for racing only. They are wonderful for the ice that we ski on here all the time, and when snowfall happesn to occurr and it isnt man made, then its possible to suffer through... or i can always break out my Salomon Xscreams for the real powder days. Honestly though - i do not like mid fats at all. I view them as a ski that performs equally poorly in a variety of conditions... they just arent good at anything. I would suggest going with a slightly wider waisted, softer flexing SL ski in order to maintain versatility, but still having high end performance. The fischer SL ski would be a great ski for you. It isnt as stiff as the Elan SLX, and some other skis out there such as the Stocklis. The rossignol 9s comes to mind as a versitile ski that may suit you. Also if youre looking towards a GS type ski try the Fischer Race Carver that they have out now. It has a huge tip and isnt a legal GS ski but i hear that it is a blast to ski on because of its tight 17m turning radius (not sure on the length that this is at though). Recently I have been free skiing my 2001 Elan SLX WC stock race skis, and ive been taking them everywhere, although i tend to stick to the groomed snow with them.

Consider the following:
Atomic SL:9
Atomic C:11
Fischer RC4 SC
Fischer RC4 RC
Elan HCX
Rossignol 9S (not the worldcup)
Rossignol Viper STX
Volkl P50 SC
Nordica K10 SLC
Nordica K10 RC
Nordica K12 SL (this ski will show you the performance you can have by sacraficing some versatility)

Those are probably the best contenders i can think of off the top of my head right now, but im sure there are more that i have overlooked. Just make sure youre on a race style ski, and not a midfat type ski. Some people will tell you that skis like the G3 and the T50 and the S500 all ski like race skis, but once you have skied on a new race ski none of them compare. The performance capabilities of new race skis on ice is incredible. True you may be impressed with a G3 or a XX at first but they are not the best out there, in fact they cannot come close to the groomed snow/ice performance that is needed to ski on the snow that you are probably used to.



[ December 30, 2002, 09:20 PM: Message edited by: HeluvaSkier ]
post #9 of 37
As a very young person and a racer, Greg, you may not find mid-fats to be very good at anything - but for many of us, they're great at a lot of things. Their width makes them easier to balance on and more stable feeling. While some other mid-fats aren't that good on very hard snow, My Rossi Bandit XX's are as good as I need. The greatest thing about mid-fats for recreational skiing is their phenomenal versatility, which skis made for racing just don't have.

I do own a pair of shorty slaloms, and when I first owned them, I thought they represented the wave of the future. That thought was put on hold when they were the only skis I had and the snow was heavy and a foot deep and chopped. At that point, I bought my first pair of mid-fats - the K2 Mod 7/8 which today is called the K2 Axis [no X]. They were just what the doctor ordered for that snow, but they were not so sharp on hard snow. The Bandit XX's, though, have great bite on hard snow.

Skiing almost entirely in Vermont, I have found the XX's the most fun pair of skis I've ever had. When the conditions are true ice all over, I may give them a rest and click into the Rossi T-Power shorty slaloms - the shortys are like ice skates.

If our questioner needs skis primarily for ice and rarely for real natural deeper snow, your recommendations sound ok, and a second pair of mid-fat skis can be available when conditions improve. It's dismaying to read that conditions in your neck of the woods are so much worse than in Vermont - and here I thought Vermont epitomized eastern skiing conditions. I'm grateful to learn that Vermont is better than that.

By the way, word is that conditions at Greek Peak were great recently - a real powder day. But I understand from what you've said that it's a rarity.
post #10 of 37
Hi Oboe,

I must agree with HeluvaSkier. I spend most of my time at Blue "Mountain" in Collingwood Ontario, with a couple trips a year to Holiday Valley. When people talk of a powder day they are usually referring to the 3-5 cm we received the night before. Rarely do we get a good dump of the real stuff. I'm in the process at the moment of getting rid of my Volkl Vectris V30's in favour of some slalom shorties. I'm looking to be able to cut several arcs into the hardpack(ice)that we are so familiar with in this area. With the general lack of vertical that we have been cursed with in Ontario [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img] , the short radius slaloms will allow me to get a few more turns off before I approach one of the high speed 6's with a 15 minute line up : . I would invest in some new slalom ski's, around 165 cm, and if the need is felt for a mid fat powder, go used. Pick something up cheap for the couple days a year that they may be needed.

I'm hopefully going to demo the Atomics and Rossignol's tomorrow (I'm at work today) and will let you know what I think.

post #11 of 37
Thread Starter 
Originally posted by Rusty Guy:
I would first say you are considering too long a ski. I grew up in western Pennsylvania, however, haven't been there in thirty years. Knowing what I do about Seven Springs I would ski a 160 cm short slalom.

Atomic SL9
Fischer WC SC
Elan SLX
Fischer Sceneo 500
Sorry, but there's NO WAY I could ski a 160, not even here at the Springs. I'd blow right out of every edge I tried to hold. 160 *might* work out west, because frankly in my 7 years out there I never saw an icey day, but not gonna happen here on the Western PA hardpack/ice. They just wouldn't fit my style. I may try 177, but that's about as short as I want to go. I'm also very leary of the midfat skis, but I guess I'll know more after trying them.
post #12 of 37
Taylormatt, it sounds like you're missing the point about the shorty slaloms. Try the Atomic VERY shorty slalom - it's built and drives like a TANK. Edge so hard you pull an edge out of that - go ahead, I want you too. Dare you to. Lotsa luck.

Look, before any preconceived notions get you to spend money, demo the living bejeesus out of skis, especially shorty slaloms and mid-fats, and for you the Volkl G3 or the Rossignol RPM 21 and race slaloms and GS skis may well be better than my beloved Bandit XX's. Please - you owe it to yourself to step into the new day and look around before you settle down.
post #13 of 37
I guess you have not spent any time on a shorty sl ski, huh?

I don't know what your style is, but those things are built specifically to hold and carve on ice. You'll be shocked by how stable even a 150 sl ski. As long as the skis are carving you have nothing to worry about. You'll blow out of the turn before the ski does. And if you're lifted up high, boot out is not an issue either. Give them a try.
post #14 of 37
Ok just to put in a back up for Rusty on the length thingy

My instructor is 6'3" 100kg ex national junior team so he goes FAST when he tries to. He skis his Stockli SLR's in a 156cm for racing. Even for all around teaching he skis the same ski in a 173or so from memory.

BTW - you could look at the 'not race' Stocklis

Vitaman, Yuki, or SnoKarver might now more about them
post #15 of 37
Originally posted by Taylormatt:
Sorry, but there's NO WAY I could ski a 160, not even here at the Springs. I'd blow right out of every edge I tried to hold. 160 *might* work out west, because frankly in my 7 years out there I never saw an icey day, but not gonna happen here on the Western PA hardpack/ice. They just wouldn't fit my style. I may try 177, but that's about as short as I want to go. I'm also very leary of the midfat skis, but I guess I'll know more after trying them.
Oboe and some of the others are absolutely right. I weigh 230 lbs. and more and more I'm becoming addicted to the very short slaloms for the conditions that you are usually stuck with in the hideous ( sorry [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img] ) Poconos. The Poconos, in no way resemble the skiing in Vermont. Have I ever skied there? No, But I've skied Hunter, Windham, etc. too many times to remember, so I think I know what you're talking about.

A midfat is a great tool, but not for crowded, icy, narrow Pocono trails where most of the day is spent dodging between crowds of beginners. I skied yesterday at Butternut Mass. (First and probably the last time) I skied it on midfats. Sorry, just not enough room to let them perform the way they were intended.

Then I demoed a pair of 160 cm. Salomon 3V slaloms, and had an absolute blast carving perfect arcs between hoardes of snowplowing bodies on some nasty skied off hardpack. I had a blast. There was no room to go fast, so I went quick instead. Loading them up and popping them from edge to edge, making almost any kind of turn I wanted. They held better than almost any ski I've ever been on.

I decided yesterday that next year I will ski a short slalom for anything south of the Vermont border and east of the Mississippi.

The Volkl Supersport 5 star in a 168 was another great ski for this type of skiing, and real nice in in a few inches of powder as well. A short slalom WILL hold on your pocono hardpack and be a better choice than a GS ski for your narrow congested trails as well. In Vermont, they're all good tools. You haven't got the luxury, and neither do I most of the time.

Happy New Year [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]
Yeah, I'm workin'.
post #16 of 37
The only way that a short slalom wont work is if you slide your turns. If you truly carve your turns and have a true two footed aggressive stance, you will have no trouble on any short slalom ski - no matter what your size, weight, or skiing ability. If you skid your turns you will hate a short slalom ski because it will be too stiff with too much side cutt and not enough edge for you because youre not using it how it was intended to be used. If you slide your turns you might as well stick with your older straight skis or a midfat that has minimal sidecut, because newer skis are not built with sliding in mind, unless you use a very low end entry level ski. And actually to comment on your thought that a 160 might work out west... A 160 will suck out west because the snow isnt hard enough. It will just sink until it hits something hard. They are designed for very aggressive edgehold. Skis like the ELan SLX are impossible to shake off the ice when you bend them into a carve, but you have to be carving. If you dont carve your turns then you wont benefit from a short slalom ski at all... or even a GS ski for that matter. The midfat is probably the ski youre going to be most comfortable on because they have more surface area and are softer flexing. Specify your style of skiing and we will be able to direct you towards the proper skis, or at least a group of skis that will suit your needs. If you dont want to go to a 160cm ski or less because you think youre too good of a skier to be on that short of a ski you should swallow your pride and try them. On hardpack anyone on a pair of short slalom skis will ski circles around anyone on a midfat - literally. Length means nothing anymore, as long as you can make the skis perform no one will care what length your skis are.
post #17 of 37
Thread Starter 
To everyone,

Thanks again for the info. I do plan on demoing everything I can get my hands on before buying. I'll give 160's a go and eat crow if they work out for me...I just can't see it happening. I'm "old school" lol. Maybe I'll be a convert, who knows?

Right now the weather in the east is crap with more crap piled on top. 40'/50's and heavy constant rain. The bases around here are melting fast. What's left will be boilerplate next week when the temps drop. If things turn around, we'll be heading for Snowshoe on the 20th and the plan is to leave my boards in the condo and ski on every brand/length demo I can get my grubby mitts on for 3 days. Same goes for my wife, she's looking too. At 5'-2" I guess she could go for 110's? lol
post #18 of 37
Go idea, Taylormatt! I do have one bone to pick with helluva, though. Some shorty slaloms which are great carvers also will skid nicely when asked.

I feel so sorry for you guys who have to ski on perpetual crap on crowded slopes. Yes, for you, the midfats are a waste, and th shorty slaloms are da MAN!

For your wife, there are some female specific skis she ought to consider in the K2 and Rossi lines. Have her start with the Rossignol T-Power Saphir [pronounced "saphire"] in a length recommemded by the shop. Womens skis sometimes get as short as 140 cm, but that may or may not be right for her. Just ask for he Saphir in the correct lenght for her height and weight.

[ January 01, 2003, 07:56 AM: Message edited by: oboe ]
post #19 of 37
Although the powder dumps are few and far in between, we do get them at H.V. To know that you have to ski here 4 times a week to catch them. Anyhow, 4" on nice stuff over corduroy is quite often here, and even that amount gets pushed into bumps towards the afternoon. Combined with the bullet proof ice in spots and the variable temps make a mid-fat the perfect ski. I keep two skis in my locker. A shorty slalom for the pristeen cord and a mid-fat for all other days. That being a XX and the shorty a Viper. Both great skis. However, if I could only have one ski to use all the time, it would be a mid-fat. I'm at 180 lbs. right now and ski a 184. Rossi is comming out this month with a replacement for the xx. Can't wait to ski on it. When I bought the xx, I weighed around 200, thus the 184. My next mid-fat will probably be a 177. I have skied the RPM and it's a sweet ski. A little stiffer than the xx and has a plate but skis about the same and indeed might be a better choice for 7 Springs. Happy New Year Oboe.
post #20 of 37
. . . a wise man speaks . . . Yo! Lars! Most Happy New Year!

Yes, the RPM felt good, and the reps either can't or wan't tell me what the change is for the new one except that it's called the B2.

I've never had a complaint about the edge hold of the current XX, 'tho the RPM obviously is grippier.

The rain wiped out a lot of early season gains here, but the temps are dropping and snow is on the way. GOTTA love the XX!

Now, how come the weight drop? pm me if you'd prefer.
post #21 of 37
My normal eastern ski (Tremblant) is a Volkl G31@188. Pretty long for the east and a mid-fat. I've been skiing since I was 10, and let's see now (counting on fingers and toes), I'm now 47. I like to ski fast and at Tremblant normally hang out with some ex-racers who love to carve. High speed stability and edge hold are important to me on those days. If the snow is good I'm in the trees. Don't really like hard bumps (who does?) Height 5'10", weight 160.

Two weeks ago I went the demo route and tried a pile of fairly short (to me) skis. Head IC200@ 170 and 177, Atomic SX11 @ 170, Elan HCX@160 (I think it was somewhere around there), and an Elan Integra 12 @ 177.

Tremblant on that weekend was defintely hard pack. It had rained Friday, they groomed that night, then it all froze solid for Saturday morning. Kind of felt like they had just iced it down for a GS or downhill race.

In these conditions I was amazed at the edge hold of all the skis, particularly the Elans. The HCX was an absolute ball, it really felt like I was on a pair of roller blades. No skid, no slide, just roll the knees and they turned. The Integra 12's also had great edge hold. They felt very damp and skied better as I went faster. Quite stiff (which I like), but I had no problem bending them. Didn't bounce around a lot, very quiet feeling as I crossed different snow types.

Liked the Atomics as well, but couldn't get enough runs on them to really get a feel for them.

Conclusion: Try lots of things, you'll be surprised, I was. I wish I could afford to buy two more pairs of skis. One pair would be the Elan HCX or SLX skis, the other pair would be something like the Integra 12 or M12 (whick is their mid-fat). I'd also like to try the Atomic SX11 for more than one run, see what it really feels like.
post #22 of 37
Thread Starter 
I feel so sorry for you guys who have to ski on perpetual crap on crowded slopes. Yes, for you, the midfats are a waste, and th shorty slaloms are da MAN!

I do too, lol. I grew up skiing here, raced here, taught here then moved to Denver for 7 years. My god did I get spoiled there. Ended up moving back to PA and pretty much gave up on skiing b/c, well, frankly it sucks here after CO. [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img] After about 6 years, we got the urge to do something in the winter again...so we tried snowboarding at the beginning of the season. BAD IDEA!! Hated it, strapped the boards back on for the remainder of the day and everything was right in the world again.

Looking forward to demoing. There is a womens demo day coming up on Tuesday at Hidden Valley, we're gonna go check it out. She can participate in that and Ski North has demos for me in the Bandit X, Axis X, Atomic SL9 (yes, even in 160's [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] ), some other Atomics and some Pilots. Should get me started. Still looking forward to Snowshoe. They seem to have a larger demo inventory, plus I can get on some Volkls and Nordicas there.

The rain is forecast to leave tonight and turn back into snow...yeeehah. The terrain was looking pretty rough up there today with lots of bare spots starting to show. WE NEED SNOW BAD!!!!!
post #23 of 37
Just want to comment on the new shorty slaloms. I tried a pair of Dynastar 157cm on our icey expert slope (steeper then anything at 7 Springs) I don't know the model. I'm 5'10", 205lbs. and never raced. I just tried them 'cause a factory rep offered. I thought they would be too one dimensional. Wow, was I wrong, not only did these carve a wicked short turn, they would hold flawless in a GS as well. All the L2 and L3 instructors seem to love them. A Fischer rep is also one of our supervisors so I see alot of Fischers here. After the shortys, I went back on my old Dynastar Max O 190cm, a good carver in it's day. These skis cattered and washed out where the shortys just held.

I ordered the Rossi Bandit XX 184cm as per oboe's suggestion. This is a great ski. I had a chance to ski the heavy freshies we had around Christmas and skied my old Chubbs as well. The Rossi's float as well as the Chubbs in the 12" heavy muck we call powder here but, wow, they turn a lot quicker. I would not discount this ski if you plan on some out of state skiing or local tree skiing. Yes, there is some tree skiing but we have to pick up the dead fall after last months ice storms. After todays rain, well, we will see what mother nature brings. The XX hold nice on ice and short turn are a snap. The single X's they sell here should be quicker yet.

You will be suprized how the snowmaking at 7 Springs will cover that boilerplate. Just think, when the corduroy is scrubbed off, that boilerplate will protect our bases from the rocks beneath [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] .

When you get tired of dodging the traffic over at the Springs, come over to empty Laurel. Check your Private Messages.

Carvemeister, Seven Springs, Hidden Valley and Laurel Mountain are in the Allegheny Mountains, the Laurel Ridge to be exact. Blue Knob is also in the Alleghenys. The Poconos are in Eastern PA. I know nobody really cares but my Picksburgh Pride is in a tizzy when yunz guys aut in da rill hills git it screwed up 'n 'at. Here we go Stillers, Here we go!

[ January 01, 2003, 07:05 PM: Message edited by: Springhill Crazie (SprgHlCrz) ]
post #24 of 37
If you get a chance try Atomics C11.16 in a 180cm , these things are a wickedly quick stable ski. Other Atomics to consider are the R11.20 in a 190cm , awsome allround ski that you will enjoy if you happen to hit some real snow. Or personally I would think real hard about the GS9.21 in 190cm , alot of past racers love this ski , very versatile and super stable . I'm 5ft.10in. and 220lbs. and have put lots of runs on all the above .
If you think you'd like the GS9.21 I know of a pair of last years race 9.20 ,190cm (same ski) in unbelievable condition (like new) with bindings .....might be what you want.
post #25 of 37
For most of us we're only going to own one pair of state of the art skis at a time. With so many possibilities it's important to choose carefully so that we end up with a versatile enough ski so that it works whatever the hill, whatever the conditions. That said, have a look at a super slalom in a longer length. At your size it might just be the ticket. At 190lb I've been skiing 180cm Head sl the last few years. This year I dropped to a 170cm Head iSl. They still work well on the manmade ice at home, but I was glad I didn't go any shorter when I got out to the Rockies over Christmas.
post #26 of 37
Thread Starter 
OK, did my first round of demos.

Atomic R11 170's
Loved em, super quick, great edge hold, a little too much tail for this rusty bump skiier. Currently in 2nd place, only lost due to being not so forgiving in the bumps. If I get out of position they throw me out of line fast. I'm definitely rusty in the bumps.

K2 Axis X and Mod
Didn't do much for me at all. Sluggish.

Salomon X scream
Like Salomons of the past, they just do nothing for me.

Atomic SL9 160's
Fun boards, but not for me as my only pair. 160 was too short for my tastes. I'd like to try it in a 170, but none were available.

Bandit X 167
Nice ride in the thick stuff, too sluggish for me though, like the Axis, didn't flip my lid.

Rossi Cobra X twin deck 167
Currently in first place. I really liked this ski in all conditions. We got an 11" dump last night and had plenty of boot deep pow, super soft bumps and groomed runs, even some wind blown ice. It held up to everything I threw at it, quick edge to edge, floated pow like a champ and rocked in the bumps. Forgiving enough to keep this rusty bumper in his line to the bottom.

I skied various lengths like 177, 182 as well, the 167-170 range seems to be maximum fun and still hold well. The longer boards lost their "fun factor" [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

I'm still going to hit every demo day opportunity I can find this year and try some others, but the Cobra X TD 167 is currently leading as a real good all terrain, all condition ski for me.

In general, I didn't care for the mid-fats. Slalom and carvers worked better for me, I prefer their feel and quickness.

I still need to try some Atomic carvers and Volkls along with a few other Rossi's that weren't there the rep suggested...I can't wait. Today was the most fun I've had on skis in a long time. Heading to the hot tub, cuz I am sore! I don't think I've logged that many turns since I spent 12 hours a day on the mountain...years ago.

[ January 07, 2003, 02:18 PM: Message edited by: Taylormatt ]
post #27 of 37

at the risk of insulting your skiing ability, I would like to suggest that you rethink your assessments of skis.

if you find the Axis X sluggish, you obviously weren't riding its sweet spot. it's not the least bit sluggish.

my guess is that you're not yet proficient at conversing with your skis. it sounds like you are trying to superimpose your old technique (which orients to your existing skis) on an entirely different ski.

are you trying to see where you need to stand, how you need to build pressure, etc, for each ski?

top mid-fat skis today are so similar that if you think one of them is "sluggish" it's almost guaranteed that the "sluggish" feeling is attributable to your technique and not the ski.
post #28 of 37
For what is may be worth:

I am a truly average skier - on a good day. Among others, I own and ski Rossi T-Power in 160 similar to the TD's you love, and Rossi Bandit XX, the quintessential mid-fat, in 170 [wider than the single X]. I am 150 lbs., 5'8" and 61 yo. When I first skied the shorties, like you, I though they were the greatest thing since sex. HOWEVER, experience has shown me that MID-FATS RULE!!!! I still use the shorties on real ice days - not icey, I mean eastern ICE - but for everthing else, I ski the Bandit XX. The K2 Axis X is "everybody's ski", and the K2 Axis XP is the only contender to the Rossi XX.

'tho it pains me so to do, I must agree with this gonzo guy - I won't be making a habit of it.

Work on technique, and the mid-fats will find their place in your heart.
post #29 of 37
Originally posted by Taylormatt:

Atomic R11 170's
Loved em, super quick, great edge hold, a little too much tail for this rusty bump skiier. Currently in 2nd place, only lost due to being not so forgiving in the bumps. If I get out of position they throw me out of line fast. I'm definitely rusty in the bumps.
Give the 11.20's another try with the bindings set forward by 1-2cm which brings them closer to being 'BOF' centered. That's the way I ski mine. You'll think you're skiing on a totally different ski. Much more responsive and snappy, plus much more manageable in the bumps.

I've tried the Bandit X and XX's and agree with your assessment of them feeling sluggish, but great stability.

Another one I tried this weekend was the Atomic SX11. Very nice, quicker than the R11, more solid at speed than the Rossi Cobra X's. Not quite the equal of the R11 off piste but better than the Cobra's. It would be one worth taking a look at.
post #30 of 37
Yah didn't try any Stocklis....
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