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post #31 of 47

I would recommend some type of Volkl Race carver for the east .

 

Very stable and good in ice carving.

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post #32 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmypowder View Post

I would recommend some type of Volkl Race carver for the east .

 

Very stable and good in ice carving.

 

Or not. A race stock ski is going to be too much ski for an intermediate casual skier. As a developing skier, a person is best suited with an all mountain ski, which will do many different things well, not a specialty ski that will only do one thing well, and hamper everything else. One doesn't need a race ski to carve. I can lay down arcs just fine on my 100mm underfoot twin tips, and I ski the East as well. I'm not sure where you ski, but its worth mentioning that the East isn't just glazed in a sheet of glare ice from November to April. We have ice, boilerplate, crud, slush, packed pow, and yes, even powder here in the East. Heck, Meathead Films just won the Best Powder award at the Powder Mag Movie Awards, for a segment filmed at Jay Peak VT. Beat out segments filmed in CO, UT, BC, and AK.

post #33 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glazo View Post

Excuse me for suggesting a method that might save STEPPAHCYDE some cash and provide an opportunity to try one or two different skis and perhaps the money saved could enable him to ski one or two more days a week...... You might be surprised at the equipment people donate to 2nd hand stores...

 

And I agree with METAPHOR that STEPPAHCYDE won't really be able to tell the difference at his level of experience and just skiing one day a week...

 

Although MATHIAS99 makes an excellent suggestion that STEPP should try two or three skis back to back on the same day if he can...

 

The HEAD bindings I mounted on the PRE M5As are on the indemnified list but wouldn't be covered because I mounted them myself... And if I don't like the PREs, I own the bindings and can mount them on a different ski if/when I choose...

 

I was very fortunate in that during my first 3 seasons I roomed with a pro patrolman in Colorado, and skiid regularly with several of the patrol people at my local ski area... I was taught that I was ultimately responsible for servicing my skis and bindings... If one learns to do his or her own ski tune up, sharpening edges, filling scrapes and occasional gashes with p-tex and carrying a small 90* filing block for touching up the edges on those inevitable days of boilerplate, one becomes confident that his bindings are set to release properly...  

 

In other words... Explore all options...Ski ski.gifresponsibly... Skiski.gif as much as you can... GLAZO...smile.gif

 

If it works for you, it works for you. But it's not a good suggestion to make to others. Sending a relatively new skier out on to the hill with a pair of 20+ year old straight skis is roughly analogous to going out deer hunting, but bringing half a dozen slingshots instead of a rifle. Sure, it's a heck of a lot cheaper. Heck, it might even kinda work. I mean, its how they did it way back in the day, right?  But is it going to work nearly as well as a rifle? Nope, not even close.

post #34 of 47
Man, that guys boots went on easy.
I dread putting mine on, total battle royale.
These new Intuitions seem easier to get on, and tired the lace up on the foot, then slide in and it seems to work better.
post #35 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmypowder View Post

I would recommend some type of Volkl Race carver for the east .

 

Very stable and good in ice carving.

 

Are people skipping right over the low intermediate part, 10 days on the hill?  Putting somebody who can't carve on skis that do nothing well but respond to proper carving inputs is just a terrible idea.

 

To the OP:

 

If i was in your position and had a limited budget to spend on ski equipment, I spend most of it on buying a good set of professionally fitted midrange boots. This can't be emphasized enough. Boots aren't sexy, but you NEED properly fitted and suitable boots to develop as a skier- you can't get better sitting in the lodge with cramping feet.

 

For skis, I would try to hit up a ski swap at the beginning of next season, order a rental-level skis from level 9 sports http://www.levelninesports.com/, or scout out consignments shops. For used skis, for somebody not familiar with binding tech, I would stay with a ski made within the last 5 years.  I would NEVER EVER EVER recommend a beginning skier buy skis with non-indemnified bindings. When the shop refuses to work on them, then the beginning skier has to take a shot in the dark at setting them up right (and evaluating that they are working properly), and will then be falling a bunch to test whether they are rreally correct.

post #36 of 47
Originally Posted by Jimmypowder

I would recommend some type of Volkl Race carver for the east .

Very stable and good in ice carving.

Are people skipping right over the low intermediate part, 10 days on the hill? Putting somebody who can't carve on skis that do nothing well but respond to proper carving inputs is just a terrible idea.



I'm not talking about a PROFESSIONAL race carver but a recreational race carver .Volkl does make them you know . My 6 year old son ,a lower
intermediate at the time , used them in Vermont all the time and loved them . You can make skidded turns but my son rapidly improved by using them
In Vermont's icy conditions . In fact at 22 years old now, he still talks about how great they were

So yes I would recommend them for East Coast skiing as they are quite narrow at the waist yet grip icy runs and are stable .

I'm not talking about buying a professional race carver lol .


If you want to rapidly improve , that type of ski will do the trick .If you don't , go ahead and buy a soft flexing,forgiving ski
that will reward poor carving technique , which by the way you really want to learn at the earliest stage .YES lower intermediate is the
right time .m
post #37 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmypowder View Post

Originally Posted by Jimmypowder

I would recommend some type of Volkl Race carver for the east .

Very stable and good in ice carving.

Are people skipping right over the low intermediate part, 10 days on the hill? Putting somebody who can't carve on skis that do nothing well but respond to proper carving inputs is just a terrible idea.



I'm not talking about a PROFESSIONAL race carver but a recreational race carver .Volkl does make them you know . My 6 year old son ,a lower
intermediate at the time , used them in Vermont all the time and loved them . You can make skidded turns but my son rapidly improved by using them
In Vermont's icy conditions . In fact at 22 years old now, he still talks about how great they were

So yes I would recommend them for East Coast skiing as they are quite narrow at the waist yet grip icy runs and are stable .

I'm not talking about buying a professional race carver lol .


If you want to rapidly improve , that type of ski will do the trick .If you don't , go ahead and buy a soft flexing,forgiving ski
that will reward poor carving technique , which by the way you really want to learn at the earliest stage .YES lower intermediate is the
right time .m

 

I'm going to disagree. Again. No, you don't want a carving ski that only does one thing well. Volkl made a genuine race ski for a 6 year old intermediate? in 1996? You realize 1996 was at the very birth of shaped skis, and comparing a ski a 6 year old was on then to a ski an adult would ski now is not like comparing apples and oranges, it's like comparing apples and Buicks. I've been teaching professionally for 10 years now, and I've never seen a 6 year old on anything that could be legitimately considered a 'race' ski, or even a genuine carving ski. Just because it says 'race' on it, doesn't make it a race ski. It's 'cool' for a 6 year old when his skis say 'Race', so they put it on there. 

 

Again, in my professional opinion, having taught a great many low intermediates, you don't want a race ski. You don't even want a carving ski. A low-to-midrange allmountain ski will be just fine. 

post #38 of 47
Thread Starter 

Hey everyone

I can't believe how this thread has taken off! Again thanks everyone for the feedback.So its been i while since the OP chimed in so let me tell yall alittle more about where im at.

I'm around 15-16 days on skis after coming off a 3 day trip to Smugglers Notch.I took a level 7 lesson while i was there and made it through with flying colors.I am now skiing in a more athletic stance and losing my bad habit of falling backseat on the edges.I really enjoy carving nice "S's" instead on making "Z's" on all Blues & Greens.I'm hoping to get to my shop today and swap the K2's out for a ski with a wood core and some sort of side wall thats less forgiving so i can get a feel for a big boy ski.My Shop is Colorado Ski Shop in West Springfield M.A. They do worldwide shipping and carry the full gamit of brands so i have alot to choose from come purchase time.They also have a outlet for discount older models.I'm on vacation this week so i'm hoping to continue to get out on the slopes.

My wife has also got the bug now and is just as excited to out there as much as possible.....Misson accomplished!!!yahoo.gif

post #39 of 47

Jimmypowder,

 

He's right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeski919 View Post

 

I'm going to disagree. Again. No, you don't want a carving ski that only does one thing well. Volkl made a genuine race ski for a 6 year old intermediate? in 1996? You realize 1996 was at the very birth of shaped skis, and comparing a ski a 6 year old was on then to a ski an adult would ski now is not like comparing apples and oranges, it's like comparing apples and Buicks. I've been teaching professionally for 10 years now, and I've never seen a 6 year old on anything that could be legitimately considered a 'race' ski, or even a genuine carving ski. Just because it says 'race' on it, doesn't make it a race ski. It's 'cool' for a 6 year old when his skis say 'Race', so they put it on there. 

 

Again, in my professional opinion, having taught a great many low intermediates, you don't want a race ski. You don't even want a carving ski. A low-to-midrange allmountain ski will be just fine. 

 

Thanks Freeski919, I was about to write something like this icon14.gif.

 

A low end advanced ski (generally covers the mid intermediate range) and has enough forgiveness and the same time won't be over powered until you get past it's range of design.  For progression, you still NEED that forgiveness as the skiers inputs are too great and varied at this stage.  Something that is a true advanced-expert ski will PUNISH every little error made and also not reward any correct action (too small of an  input) because the skier lacks the strength and follow through.

 

Don't get me wrong I love full blown races skis and ski them as my everyday skis (both SL and GS) and I don't race.  I just love the feel (because this is what I skied for most of my life), but I do not recommend it for anyone unless that is what they are ready for it and are prepared for the consequences and commitment required.  Even those that think they are ready are usually surprised by the focus and commitment required by race skis (and after skiing them, understand how good the skiers are that make them look like everyday run of the mill skis, it does take commitment)

 

I believe SerriaJim said it best "advancing-intermediate skis are good".

post #40 of 47

I don't recommend race-oriented skis for a new and developing skier.  You'll never outgrow them, but they are often hard to handle and are specifically designed to go fast on hard snow.  That said, I also don't recommend buying extremely "beginner" or "novice" skis, since you will outgrow those quickly.  They're too soft and will not work well on steeper slopes or if you want to go fast.

 

What you want (IMO) is a relatively "forgiving" intermediate/advanced ski, with a frontside bias (~85mm width or less -- narrower being better on very hard snow or ice).  Some magazine ratings try to measure 'forgiveness', and people will often discuss it in reviews here.  realskiers.com has in-depth reviews of tons of skis, including whether they think they are suitable for beginner/intermediate skiers, but it costs $20 for a year subscription.

 

For instance, these are high-end 'recreational race' skis: http://www.fischersports.com/us/Alpine/Products/Skis/Race , http://www.dynastar.com/US/US/dynastar-skis-men-race.html

 

I'd look more for something like these: http://www.fischersports.com/us/Alpine/Products/Skis/High-Performance , http://www.fischersports.com/us/Alpine/Products/Skis/All-Mountain , http://www.dynastar.com/US/US/dynastar-skis-men-all-mountain.html

 

(I happen to own some Dynastar and Fischer skis, so I know their product lines, but every brand makes something like this.)

post #41 of 47
Quote:
My wife has also got the bug now and is just as excited to out there as much as possible.....Misson accomplished!!!yahoo.gif

That's fantastic! I just got back from skiing this morning with my sweetie and I must say there's (almost) nothing better than that. 

 

Regarding the new skis -- did you tell us if the Colorado Ski Shop offers season lease packages for adults? That would really be your safest bet if you don't feel comfortable choosing one ski, but be sure to check that they have the skis if you want to upgrade. I did this with my kids for several years and we were well satisfied with the gear and the economy. 

post #42 of 47
Thread Starter 

@ Nolo

I just read your response back to the Wifey and she said "Thats super nice! i can't wait to actuallly ski with you(i have advanced WAY faster than her).As far as the lease goes,i did lease the skis/boots that i'm on currently from CO.I will use them for the rest of the season. They are willing to let me demo a pair of Blizzard magnum 7.6 but say they might be alittle too much ski for me for a couple days untill i figure them out.They also have a good deal on the last  pair of Blizzard 7.4 from last year that i cannot demo but basically get at a steal.Just so you know i am not only sold on Blizzard.....its just what some have pointed me at.

post #43 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by steppahcyde22 View Post

Hey everyone

I can't believe how this thread has taken off! Again thanks everyone for the feedback.So its been i while since the OP chimed in so let me tell yall alittle more about where im at.

I'm around 15-16 days on skis after coming off a 3 day trip to Smugglers Notch.I took a level 7 lesson while i was there and made it through with flying colors.I am now skiing in a more athletic stance and losing my bad habit of falling backseat on the edges.I really enjoy carving nice "S's" instead on making "Z's" on all Blues & Greens.I'm hoping to get to my shop today and swap the K2's out for a ski with a wood core and some sort of side wall thats less forgiving so i can get a feel for a big boy ski.My Shop is Colorado Ski Shop in West Springfield M.A. They do worldwide shipping and carry the full gamit of brands so i have alot to choose from come purchase time.They also have a outlet for discount older models.I'm on vacation this week so i'm hoping to continue to get out on the slopes.

My wife has also got the bug now and is just as excited to out there as much as possible.....Misson accomplished!!!yahoo.gif


Awesome that you're having a ton of fun with your skiing.  If you are really skiing as a strong level 7, you can pretty much go out there and buy anything you want.  This thread sort of diverged into a tangent about whether a beginner/low intermediate should be on a racing ski, but if you are skiing as well as you say, that conversation is totally irrelevant.  If you really enjoy carving on hardpack then maybe you should be looking at a ski designed specifically for carving (although probably not a $2000 pair of Stockli racing skis).  Maybe look at some Volkls or Rossis.  I grew up skiing bullet proof groomers in NY and VT, so I know how important a ski that holds a great edge is.  But ultimately you have to decide what type of skiing you like to do most often and what type of ski is going to best suit those conditions.  

 

If you are skiing primarily on the east coast then you probably want to eliminate all powder ski options...anything over 100mm at the waist would probably be a bad choice.  That being said, something between 90mm and 100mm might not be a bad option.  These skis are typically marketed as your "all mountain" or "one ski quiver".  From personal experience, I don't disagree one bit with this label.  My 99mm Salomon Shoguns are one of the most versatile skis I've ever been on.  If I had to fly someplace and I could only take one pair of skis, it would undoubtedly be my Shoguns.  They rip bumps, slay the park, float in powder (probably wouldn't use them in more than 14"-16" of fresh though), and carve a turn like you wouldn't believe.  Check out some skis that fall into this category and see if you can demo something.  

 

Now if you really like carving and feel as though you may want to start running some gates, go ahead and get a ski designed for that application.  The point is, you're having fun with your skiing and you're advancing in the sport at a very rapid rate, which is phenomenal.  As a strong level 7, you should be starting to figure out what you like and what you don't like and exactly what you demand from your equipment.  Put some thought into this if you haven't already.  Also start to think about what direction you want to take your skiing in.  Do you want to ski fast?  Do you want to do jumps and slide rails?  Do you want to huck huge cliffs?  Do you want to make dainty turns though intermediate bumps?  It doesn't matter so long as your having fun.  Figure out what you're most into and buy a ski that suits those needs.

 

And after all that, I still stick to my original suggestion to you.  Rossignol S80 Freerides will give you a tremendous amount of versatility on the east coast.  And for $260 brand new it is an economical ski as well.  End rant.   

post #44 of 47
Thread Starter 
Hey guys
I will be looking to start budgeting for demos on mountain as I continue to progress.I really appreciate how helpful everyone has been.Currently I don't have any aspirations to race the gates(but who knows,I've never tried).i'm leaning more now towards What Hippy has been suggesting with more of a all mountain 1 ski quiver.i like to float around on edge on the groomers and will def take some sort of lesson in the future on bumps &trees.My head has always been in the mountains and back country so I believe my heart will take me in that direction.i will continue to leave feedback on what I demo and how said ski felt.Please stay tuned as your responses have helped so much and will continue to!
post #45 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by steppahcyde22 View Post

First,thanks for all the help everyone.
Alittle more info: I leased a package for the season.K2 stinger Nordica boots.
The boots fit ok.went to Jiminy sat and felt like i started swimming in them forward and aft.possible heel lift has me In the backseat on edge.My shop(colorado ski) suggested a insert after trying on a size down.I will be at M.t snow Sunday trying my inserts i already own.
Also, I have looked a lot at the K2 photons as a possibility.I am just worried about making a pricey mistake on a ski. I really want to make sure I get something that will challenge me for the next 5+ years and still be super fun to carve while allowing me to advance to the bumps and trees.I will be spending most of the rest of the season at Stratton.
Thanks again

 

Go to Green Mountain Orthotic in the little ski shop just behind the main lodge at Stratton.  Talk with Bill Haight, master bootfitter and super guy.  Talk to him about boots.  Get some.

 

Then rent demo skis for a while.  Try a different kinds of ski every week.  Buy skis you've fallen in love with (while skiing on them with your new boots) in late February or early March online when they are on clearance sale.  You can buy skis online easily if you know what you want.  (Never, EVER, consider buying boots online.)  On this rabid skiers' forum you are going to get hammered to get the boots first. This is very good advice.  Just do it.

post #46 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by steppahcyde22 View Post

First,thanks for all the help everyone.
Alittle more info: I leased a package for the season.K2 stinger Nordica boots.
The boots fit ok.went to Jiminy sat and felt like i started swimming in them forward and aft.possible heel lift has me In the backseat on edge.My shop(colorado ski) suggested a insert after trying on a size down.I will be at M.t snow Sunday trying my inserts i already own.
Also, I have looked a lot at the K2 photons as a possibility.I am just worried about making a pricey mistake on a ski. I really want to make sure I get something that will challenge me for the next 5+ years and still be super fun to carve while allowing me to advance to the bumps and trees.I will be spending most of the rest of the season at Stratton.
Thanks again

 

If you are swimming in your boots, you need to return them and get a pair a size smaller for this seasonal rental.  You will immediately notice a change in your skiing.  The skis will respond to your foot movements with no lag time if the boots fit properly.  80% of new skiers are in boots two sizes too large.  A beginner just won't know what a good fit feels like at first.  

 

To confirm this, take the liners out of your boots and stand in them barefooted.  Scoot your feet forward until the toes bump into the front wall of the toebox.  You should have one finger's diameter of empty space behind your heel.  OK, you're a beginner.  Maybe a finger and a half, but no more.  If you have more, the inserts are absolutely necessary, but they just won't deliver ski performance like a well-fitting boot will.  

 

The boot is a tool that costs a lot of money because it does something.  It transfers the tiny movements of your foot and ankle to the skis.  But it won't do any of that if your foot is swimming, or cushioned with soft smooshy stuff that fills in the empty spaces.  The cushy stuff will soak up your foot movements.  All your skis will know about is your big movements, and there will be lag time between when you make those movements and when the boot shells finally deliver that info to the skis.  You won't be able to learn to give subtle messages to your skis with your feet and ankles in generic boots that don't match the shape of your feet.  

 

Boots can be sexy -- if they deliver subtle messages.  

post #47 of 47

Since you are looking at boots, my take on it is that boots are selected based on three different fits.

 

Comfort (the plush as a Cadillac, who cares about handling)

 

Performance (snug and comfortable like a Audi, performance and comfort)

 

Race (shoe horn fit, like an F1, support and performance, comfort...you mean that's a word and is important?)

 

Personally I'd try for something between the last two (I'm starting to get old enough to appreciate the word comfort).

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