or Connect
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › My Old Man- Needs a new hard snow ski
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

My Old Man- Needs a new hard snow ski

post #1 of 26
Thread Starter 

So my Pops is 63, good athlete, will have at least one knee replaced down the road, skis Vermont every weekend, 4hrs a day, has for 15 years.  Best on groomed terrain.  Not a train-track carver, he skis relatively fast, opens it up to what I'd call a nice J3 SuperG turn and understands the fall line but doesn't use his edges as blades, they are used more to control his thrill level and trust of the snow.  He uses his size well at 5'11 200lbs and loves all kinds of pitch variation, who doesn't?

 

He's uses two skis:

 

1. (early season and stiff snow)-  2005 Fischer RX8 fti 165cm, 115-66-98mm, less than 15m radius,  freeflex 12- Ski is deader than dead

 

2. (mid-late season and softer snow)- 200? Vist X-Free, used as a demo, 171-2cm,  has to be 127-76-103mm or so.  Speedlock and plate.  Still great for him in softer snow.

 

Boot- Speedmachine 14

 

 

Been considering a slalom shaped carver with a waist of 65-69 (stockli, head ispeed, ititan?, etc.) but I know he likes the lightweight feel and quickness of the fischer because of his knees.  His turning transitions are not his strength and he feels the weight, but feels more of the width. 

 

I've hesitated to buy for him in the off-season because I didn't know if I was missing something in the 75-85mm range that may great.  But I'm not so sure that's the ski he really needs at this point.

 

Curious what you would put him on, thanks in advance.

post #2 of 26

Softer boots!  smile.gif

post #3 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Softer boots!  smile.gif

ROTF.gif

 

beercheer.gif

 

Thanks.  After today, I needed that.

post #4 of 26
Thread Starter 

Could soften his boots
 

post #5 of 26
Thread Starter 

Could give him a kids race ski, all splendid options

post #6 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Softer boots!  smile.gif

no boot talk in skis threads! hopmad.gif
 

Have you looked at the blizzard Power line? they are getting good reviews and sound like they could fit in that 160-170cm 13-17m window that your are looking for...

post #7 of 26
Thread Starter 

will check em out, thanks

post #8 of 26

high G-force turns are fun and they take a lot of strength and endurance. preferences in gear may evolve to accommodate physiological changes.

post #9 of 26

I am about his age and size and use a Fischer Progressor 10 (think called Progressor 1000 now) as my hard snow ski. Pretty good for edge grip and all sizes of turns. If he likes his RX8's suggest looking into a Progressor.

post #10 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by jzamp View Post

no boot talk in skis threads! hopmad.gif

 
Have you looked at the blizzard Power line? they are getting good reviews and sound like they could fit in that 160-170cm 13-17m window that your are looking for...

That was a joke... Really. smile.gif. Good call on the skis though.cool.gif
post #11 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post


That was a joke... Really. smile.gif. Good call on the skis though.cool.gif

mine too  wink.gif 

i just wanted to use the little mad red man biggrin.gif

post #12 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Softer boots!  smile.gif

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzamp View Post

no boot talk in skis threads! hopmad.gif
 

Have you looked at the blizzard Power line? they are getting good reviews and sound like they could fit in that 160-170cm 13-17m window that your are looking for...

No No No, you got it all wrong.  

He needs to get dear old dad into a race plug boot.  That'll make him super fast!!

biggrin.gif

 

 

All joking aside, there are some great skis for the front side that are not talked about as much as they could be/should be. 

Fischer's progressor line is really nice, as well as the Rossignol Experience Line, and Dynastar's outland line.  Of course the Blizzard Power line  is talked about a lot because Blizzard has been in the forefront of ski technology in the past few years and their power line is pretty darn awesome.

One of the skis for front side that wow'd testers at Mt Rose last year was the Nordica Firearrow EDT84  That may be more of a ski than dad wants but these are all line ups that manufacturers are hitting out of the park. 

post #13 of 26

KC:

 

You are kind of all over the map with your descriptions and request here. First, if your dad is a not a real "carvey" kind of guy and he has fatigue issues, I don't think your idea of a Slalom Type carver is the best choice. Fortunately, most of the skis you mention are really not SL type skis anyway. Second, given your description of his skiing, I suspect a fairly low edge angle style, possibly a relatively narrow stance and a little more skiddy type turn than a locked on a rail type. Third, given your description of his preferred turn shape and speed, I think a ski under 170 such as his old Fischers is maybe not the best idea. He certainly has the size for a longer ski and apparently the speed to appreciate it. All these analyses may be wildly incorrect but that is what you are describing. While there have been some great suggestions about wider all mountain "uberskis" such as the Nordica FA-84 (that is a truly great ski) it really sounds as if he is a candidate for a more classic type of ski in the low-mid 70's in width.

 

I can see a couple of possible directions to go here.

 

(#1) Real honest to gosh hard snow trench digger. These will hold almost like a race ski, have great stability and a lot of power. They will require a little more attention from the skier but will reward the technically sound. Two great examples are the Head iSpeed Magnum and the Dynastar Course Ti.

 

................Or.................

 

(#2) A hard snow "cruiser". This will be less stiff overall and especially torsionally than (1) but will have adequate grip for most conditions shy of transparent. While not as glam as the skis in (1) this type of ski will be very smooth, damp and comforting on firm to very hard snow. Two outstanding examples here are the K2 "Charger" or "Bolt". Another ski with just a little more juice than those is the Rossi "Pursuit HP"

 

So............My suggestion here is something in the #2 range in a low-mid 170 length. I'm about your dads age and size and on hard snow days, I'll generally pick one of the skis from (#1). That's me, and not him. I'm a fairly different skier than he sounds like and my choice should probably not be his choice.

 

SJ

post #14 of 26

Sounds like the wrong color boot, his Speedmachine 14's are red, switch to a blue boot. The Vist X-Free is a darn nice ski and oh BTW. 124/77/110 are the dims in a 170 and have a real nice binding in the Speedlock. Have you considered maybe taking that ski into a good tuning shop and freshening up the ski? I am not talking REI or Bob's Ski & Patio Furniture but a good race shop. I would do this first and them maybe demo some of the skis that SJ mentioned including a couple of Kastle MX's. 

post #15 of 26
Thread Starter 
Thanks SJ, that's good info, I'll look at them. Appreciate the help.
post #16 of 26

Elan Waveflex 12 is a ski you might want to consider. I'm about the same size as your Dad and skied the Fischer RX9 for several years in the past and really liked it. I replaced the Fischers as my hard snow ski with the Elan and it really fits the bill for me. It's a traditional carver (125/74/104   ~15m radius)  capable of all but highest level of performance and yet it is manageable and less demanding than skis with a lot of metal in them. As I'm getting older,  I wanted a ski that I could take anywhere on hard snow days and ski hard all day long without getting beat up in the process. These skis will rail on edge or if you want you can drift them comfortably. Not the lightest set up on the mountain however.

 

Elan makes some great skis. You won't hear much about them here on this forum because I don't think any of the retailers/experts here carry them in their stores (maybe for good reason, I don't know). I'd be interested to hear from some of the  industry-savvy folks here why Elan doesn't get more attention in North America. I'm guessing that ad dollars and athlete representation have something to do with it.-- No, I'm not an Elan plant--just an enthusiastic skier who has had good experience with Elan skis.

 

The good news is that there are so many really nice skis on the market that you can't go too far wrong if you know what you are looking for--that is the key, know what you (your dad) want from the ski.

post #17 of 26
Quote:

Originally Posted by KeepCold View Post

 

Been considering a slalom shaped carver with a waist of 65-69 (stockli, head ispeed, ititan?, etc.) but I know he likes the lightweight feel and quickness of the fischer because of his knees.  His turning transitions are not his strength and he feels the weight, but feels more of the width. 

 

 

It sounds like your ideas of how waist widths align with intended use are based on the state of the art in 2004, not 2012. (Hard snow ski with a 60s width; soft snow ski with a '70s width.) There's not much left out there these days at "65-69", that's not a serious race-carver or actual race ski. Even those are tending more towards the low 70s these days (like the excellent Dynastar Course Ti that Sierra Jim mentions). If you really want one of those, a good choice that's more slalomy than the Dynastar and shares some characteristics with the RX-8, maybe a bit more crisp, is the Fischer Superrace SC. This is their most easy-going slalom ski and is a lot of fun for the right skier, especially if he's already a Fischer fan. Does your dad WANT to learn the modern cross-under train-track g-force thing? Does he have the strength and motivation to do it (see davluri's post)? If so, this kind of ski might be a good direction. If he doesn't - and lots of people who say they do really don't - then you don't need the skinnier ski at all, IMHO. Just tune up the Vist, like Philpug says. That's already a narrow ski by today's standards. (Whether it's a good hard snow ski I don't know first hand, but based on the brand and the fact that it has a plate, I'm guessing it is ... probably better than the RX-8 was.)

 

In short, it sounds to me like he already has the hard snow ski in the Vist, assuming it gets a good tune, and if he needs anything it's probably a modern soft snow ski in the 85mm range for spring conditions, etc., notwithstanding your comment that he "feels more of the width." This kind of ski is actually a lot more friendly to old-school feet-close-together types, in my view, because of the typically straighter sidecuts and softer torsion than you get on the dedicated hard snow short turn models.

post #18 of 26

Head I Supershape speed in a 170.  14.3 m radius.  

post #19 of 26
Thread Starter 
Thanks SJ, you hit it on the head, I'll look into eac hof them, thanks all
post #20 of 26

Agree with you on the the Elans.  Just about every Elan I have skied over the last few years has been impressive.

 

I think you don't hear a lot about them is they don't spend much on advertising and their graphics have not been great.  They make skis for quite a few other major manufacturers as well, so they have the technical know how.
 

post #21 of 26

27 November 2012

 

Hey, I just turned 60, havent clicked into my boards since 2008... My primary skis are 212cm -  Dynamic VR 17s - Giant Slalom cut... They don't even want to turn until about 40mph... Believe it or not, I used them when I was a beginner ski instructor in 1986 near Lake Tahoe... They are stable as a rock up to 70 mph...

 

If Pops wants a real thrill, I have a new (as in never been drilled for bindings) pair of K-2 Four COMPs (competition)

207 cm - length x 87mm - tip x 67mm - mid-ski x 77 mm - tail ... Not sure if they are considered Slalom or GS...

 

They are the same classic skis pictured on Powder Magazine' 40th Anniversary Edition published about a year ago...

 

I doubt if I will use them because they are so similar to my VR 17s...

 

I just ordered a pair of HEAD Free Flex Plus 11 Ski Bindings from Level Nine Sports in Salt Lake City... $96 with shipping.. I will mount those on an classic pair of 204 cm PRE - M5a (made in Salt lake City USA) to begin the season, because I purchased a Virtual Midweek Season Pass at MtBaldy in Southern California... I CAN'T WAIT TO SKI... 4 friggin years is too too too too long a time to be on the wagon...LOL...

 

If you think Pops (or anyone responding to this chain) would be interested in the K-2s, e-mail me at glazoramik1@juno.com . I will make you an excellent deal.. I just want to see someone use them...

 

2 Z schlopes...

 

Glazo...

post #22 of 26

I second Bill Miles suggestion.  The progressor series are great skis.  I have the Progressor 900.  I'm 70 and a long time skier.  These skis are used in all terrain.  I learned to ski (powder?) here in the Pacific Northwest on 200cm Olin 
DTSL's about 30 years ago.

post #23 of 26
DTSLs aren't that old. I'd say mid nineties. That makes them 20 at the oldest. Pretty sure, anyway.
post #24 of 26

I'm 66 and ski 50-60 days a year.   When it was time to retire my RX8s, I got a pair of Progressor 8+.   All the hard snow grip of the RX8 but more versatility.  If I was replacing them, the Progressor 900 would be on the short list. 

post #25 of 26

You are correct.  I first purchased Volkl Targa R's 29 years ago.  I did not learn to powder ski on them at that time.  It was my purchase of the Olin DTSL in 205's that I began to powder ski.  20 years ago.  The Olin's were not a better ski than the Volkl, it just took me 10 years to flounder and learn to ski in what our area calls powder.  I bet either ski was not much over 70mm underfoot.

 

I just purchased Kastle's MX88 yesterday.  I am confident of the purchase despite not demoeing the ski.  I have received fine advice from this site, Dawgcatching.com and realskiers.com in the past.  We don't have a Kastle dealer in the Portland metro area.

 

2 years ago my wife  purchased a 1905 Steinway grand piano.  She uses the piano daily and she deserved to get it.  Now I have my "grand piano" in my Kastle ski.   

post #26 of 26

So did you get dad softer boots ?

 

Or at least get those softened ?

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Ski Gear Discussion
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › My Old Man- Needs a new hard snow ski