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Advice on mid-fat for 1 ski quiver

post #1 of 30
Thread Starter 

Hello there,


Looking forward to getting a new pair of skis for next season, since skiing means getting on a plane for me, it has to be a 1 ski quiver that can handle well both - on and off piste.


Me: 32, 5'10, 156, in good shape.

Been skiing for the last 16 years, but in the last 3 I had the opportunity to enjoy longer seasons and became a more advanced skier.

Usually ski in South America and interior BC. 50% on and 50% piste. I like powder bowls, trees, bumps and also some nice corduroy (don't care about park)


I ski on head monsters im77, which I like on crud / chopped snow and groomers, but they are not the best tool for when you get 8" + of snow or even for bumps.


Looking for something lighter (more flex?)  with better float (90 - 100 waist?) and quick turning on tight terrain, but also enjoyable on the groomers.


I narrowed my research to a few brands / models:


Icelantic - Pilgrim, Nomad (STF?)

Prophet - 90 (Flite?)

Armada - ARV / TST

Volki      - Keno / Mantra

Salomon - Lord / Rocker 92


I know that there are many other, but since I probably won't be able to demo most of them, I would like to have 2 or 3 as a terget...

Any suggestions / inputs?



post #2 of 30
Me: 6'2" , 200 +, ski Japan/NZ/Oz/n. America.
Have used my im77's at all of the above places but my go to do everything ski now is the Volkl Mantra.
I mounted some railflex plates on them and used the tyrolia bindings that came with my monsters.
Makes them even more versatile as I can slip them off for travelling. in harder conditions and on piste, I have them set on the line, when its 50/50 variable conditions I have them back 1.5cm and when in deeper powder(Japan) i have them back 3cm behind the line.

I have just purchased some wider (109) skis for a trip to the NZ club fields in a few weeks but unless it starts puking down, I will re pack and take the Mantras.
Having said that, many lighter skiiers feel that the Mantras are too stiff.
post #3 of 30

OP: Maybe "none of the above?" 


The Volkls are nice groomer and crud skis, but too stiff for a guy your size and not great pure powder skis. Have owned several Mantras. The Icelantics sem to have a lot of fans, but IMO are somewhat specialized, again not groomer skis. 


The Sollie Lord is a nice easy going intermediate to advanced ski that probably won't hold up to your demands. Cannot speak to the other.


The Prophet is a nice all-around, but kinda old design and not stupendous on groomers. Owned one. 


Armadas are a strong choice for powder, dubious about days then the weather doesn't deliver.


My alternatives to think on, no particular order but annotated to strengths, all biased toward soft snow, but all with the ability to deliver on groomers, all between 98 and 101, which is where you want to be, not 90-100:


1) Moment PB&J - Great all-around, B+ in everything, touch stiff if you like that

2) Blizzard Kabookie - Great all-around B+ in everything, bit softer and less rockered than the PB&J

3) Rossignol S3 - Best for tight spaces, cut-up or fresh, and bumps/trees, soft and rockered, so weakest on hardpack

4) Kastle BMX98 - Best at speed, on groomers, and in crud/variable, touch stiff for bumps, most traditional feel, most demanding

5) PM Bros 179 - Best for sidecountry and adventuring, lightest, so easy in bumps but can get knocked a bit at speed in crud, fairly stiff

6) Salomon Shogun - Best for actual powder, solid grip but not a short turn specialist, second most traditional feel, stabile but lively

post #4 of 30

Rossignol E98 - can do it all, fantastic ski.

post #5 of 30

wow, there's a ton of potential skis in this class!


Blizz Bushwacker comes to mind but Fujas may be an excellent option here. the S3 is a great ski too.  Armada TST. You may be able to find a pair of blizz' The ones



or even the Sickle or the SFB (althgough a bit on the wide side for you OP)


So many skis' 

post #6 of 30
Thread Starter 

I know you can't have it all in only 1 ski, so I guess I'm willing to sacrifice a little bit of grooming performance in order to have better off-piste /powder performance.


Since I'm relatively lightweight, and I already have a heavy / stiff ski, I thought it would be better to go for something lighter / softer...

Also, I thought that short turning ratio would be a good idea for tight spaces, though I know that on powder it's not necessarily true. that is why I was first interested on the Icelantics and Armada TST.



The Kabookie and the S3 look very nice, my only question is how would they perform on hard / groomed snow with the tip rocker and 21m sidecut?


But I guess with the new technologies, you can have some tip rocker and still perform well on hard snow...


Finndog, how would you compare the Bushwacker and the Pilgrim? My reference would be the Lords, which I skied a lot and liked the way they turn and ski short for the size (a bit stiff as well on soft snow)

post #7 of 30

The bushwacker has some rocker and should give better float. I also still believe the Flipcore is for real and I like the feel of that ski. It's a fun ski.  the Pilgrim is a good ski and also fun. I skied that for a couple of seasons. I just think the Bush is a better, more versatile ski.


dont rule out the S3 or the Fujas......

post #8 of 30

Salomon Shogun is a solid suggestion.  I picked up a new pair last year in a 173cm and I found it to be extremely versatile.  Perhaps not ideal in super deep pow but with a 100mm waist you can pretty much do anything.  My only complaint would be the cap construction.  Other than that they are a solid one ski quiver. 

post #9 of 30

A little off topic but just because I`m a little curious. Is it worth buying skis if you live in Brazil, so you can`t drive to any resort or ski area. So if you consider traveling with your gear boots+skis, plus maintenance for lets say a couple of weeks each year. Isn`t a better idea to rent skis and maybe have just your own boots? Not sure if air companies will charge for check-in ski bags but I`m assuming they would which make it eeven more expensive, not saying it can also hurt our equipment.


I would say you have though about that, also I have no idea what kinda gear is available at South America to rent, do they have current season skis or stuff that is at least not older than a couple of seasons?

post #10 of 30

Blizzard kabookie or Rossi Scimitar. Blizzard the one, if you can find them. 

post #11 of 30
Thread Starter 

Since most airlines don't charge extra for skis on international flights (unless it's overweighted),  I'd say that money wise it's worth it getting your own skis. If in a given season I ski a couple of weeks in SA and than another 2-3 weeks in NA it's 20+ days to pay for rentals per year... Besides that I like doing road trips, skiing a couple of days in different mountains, so it's good no to worry about renting gear.

Also, you don't get that much diversity of gear in SA resorts... but I don't change skis every season.


But anyway, thanks for the inputs, right now the bushwacker is top of my list. I guess the 173 would be the best size...

post #12 of 30

PB&J, possibly the best one ski quiver created.

post #13 of 30
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by tsk94 View Post

PB&J, possibly the best one ski quiver created.

They look like really nice skis.

My doubt is if I should go for 90 or 100 underfoot ski...

How do you like them on bumps? How is the edge to edge grip on a groomer day?



post #14 of 30
Originally Posted by tromano View Post

Blizzard kabookie or Rossi Scimitar. Blizzard the one, if you can find them. 

I ride "the one". I absolutely love them.
post #15 of 30

for me 3 years with one ski for all terrain:


Duret mountain 177               ...wonderful!



post #16 of 30

I demoed the Fischer Big Stix at Mt. Rose during last season's Epicski gathering. I think they were 98mm wide under foot. A great ski and worth adding to your demo list imo. 90 to 100mm for western N.A. should be the right width.

post #17 of 30

keep in mind he wants something on the softer side. The shogun big stix and many others are all good skis but they aren't what I would call softer ski's.


tops for me:





The  One

post #18 of 30

The Bushwacker is a great option if you are looking for a ski in this range that is slightly softer with a soft snow bias. 

post #19 of 30

^^^^ Yeah, I assumed you wanted a ski with a soft snow bias based on your intended uses. But you've mentioned concern for groomers enough now that I'll amend suggestions for a 98-ish, agree that the Bushwacker (or the upcoming Outland 87) might be perfect compromise. Just keep in mind that if you're in actual powder over 6-8", especially if it's got some water in it, you may need to do more work. Repeat after me: Life is full of tradeoffs. Skiing is part of life. Skiing is full of tradeoffs. One of the tradeoffs will be soft snow versus hard snow. 

post #20 of 30
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by beyond View PostRepeat after me: Life is full of tradeoffs. Skiing is part of life. Skiing is full of tradeoffs. One of the tradeoffs will be soft snow versus hard snow. 

You are right, I know I'll never have it all in only 1 ski. That's why I still don't know if I should go for a 88-ish or 98-ish.

Though I usually ski 50% piste and 50% off, I think I may have more fun skiing hard snow with a ski that is relatively fat and soft, than skiing soft snow with a stiff/narrow ski.


Maybe the Bushwacker is a good option for an everyday ski, and if it's a real powder day I should rent something really powder oriented... ($ 383 for the 2012 Bushwacker on skis.com)


What about the Volkl Bridge and it's ELP Rocker and 95 waist?


Thanks again

post #21 of 30
Originally Posted by Thiago View Post

They look like really nice skis.

My doubt is if I should go for 90 or 100 underfoot ski...

How do you like them on bumps? How is the edge to edge grip on a groomer day?




At 101 underfoot I was kinda nervous about them too for use in the bumps, turns out I actually really like how they work. Tip and tail rocker makes them very easy to pivot and maneuver. Edge grip, better then both S3 and Bushwackers (demoed S3's, owned Bushwackers).


Let me know if you got any other questions.

post #22 of 30

I'm also pretty light.  I'll second what Dano posted about the Fischer Big Stix 98  (the previous few years it was the Watea 98).    Very light, lively, and quick, does better in powder than you'd expect for a 98mm wide ski.   I had the most fun with these of any ski I've demo'd.    Sierra Trading Post has the Watea 98.  Big Stixx will be out in the fall.


Since you like your Head Monsters, you might also check out the Head Rev 105 (also new for 2012/2013).  They seemed huge at first (144 wide at the tip, 105 at the waist) but they have a pretty short turning radius, I think 16m.  They did great in deep snow and totally destroyed cut up crud, but what really surprised me is how easy they were through moguls. Without feeling heavy or damp, they still absorbed the bumps and vibrations enough that I could ski longer down a mogul field without stopping, more than I can ever recall doing before.  Something in the construction was working for me, at least.  I didn't have any long stretches on packed groomers (lot of new snow that day), but they feel really stable on everything I skied.  





post #23 of 30

Blizzard Bushwacker or Kabookie (the Bonafide will be too stiff for your size/weight).  Head 105 is a polarizing ski, some love it some don't. I didn't, YMMV.  I second that beyond said: any ski is a compromise, so, pick your poison.  

post #24 of 30

before you buy on skis.com why not ask any of our sponsors here if they can match or offer something competitve?  The Bush was my 1st thought  (post #5) and I really think you would like it. I am sure you noticed the number of others who agree; Its a ski you can have fun on but it can be serious when needed.

post #25 of 30

^^^^ What he said. In my experience, the online warehouses don't save you much $$ compared to folks here who sell skis, when you factor in the expertise and various ancillary expenses like mounting, shipping etc. Phil's place http://shop.starthaus.com/store/pc/2012-Skis-c263.htm has a better sale price on Bushwackers right now than skis.com, and trust me, will give you waaaay better advice and prep; Dawg http://www.dawgcatching.com/ski-s-1/blizzard.htmlalso is carrying 2012 Bushwackers at a good sale price and does great prep, will mount for free. You get the idea. One of the points of being part of this community is to support the bricks and mortar people who are giving you some very solid advice for free, and who will stand by their products. Good luck on that if you buy from a warehouse. 

post #26 of 30

I was mulling over this same question myself a while back and there really isn't one answer anyone can really give you, it always comes down to your individual preferences. I would definitely check out the Rossignol S3 and the Line Prophet 98 or 90 both have some tip rocker and cap-wall construction so it can grip with side wall underfoot but cap wall in the tip and tail to reduce the overall weight. I'm obviously a little biased (I own the Prophet 98's) but I think they're worth at least looking at along with the S3. Everyone on this forum seems to be partial to Blizzard's as well, I've never tried a pair myself but they seem to get positive reviews on here so probably worth a look. The Volkl Bridge could be another option for you, it's very light and I don't think there's much if any metal in the ski (don't quote me on that I'm not positive) not too stiff so could work decently in the bumps.


Oh, and despite what some may tell you don't worry about using a 90-100 underfoot ski in the bumps they'll work just fine once you're oriented to your new ski and if you know how to ski moguls well it won't affect you that drastically if at all. That was something I was apprehensive about myself, but trust me you'll be fine maybe not as quick as something slimmer underfoot, but unless your competing it's not a noticeable difference. 

post #27 of 30

+1 for exploring the sponsors of this site.  I have bought from Starthaus and Dawgcatching, and they saved me money not only with a great deal (better than what I have seen on STP and Evo for out of season stuff), but by selling me the right ski for me, the first time; it's pricier to buy stuff twice.  I love online shopping (Amazon Prime rocks!), but skis seem to require a little more... translation?  Can't think of the right word, but Phil at Starthaus and Scott at Dawgcatching creep me out by seemingly having a USB plug inside my brain.  


As far as your original question: light, quick-turning and enjoyable on groomers?  Especially for your weight, the Head Rev 105.  Great float, 16m sidecut gives quickness, construction is lively.  I am the same height as you, 15 kilos heavier.  I skied them at Heavenly last year, mostly family-friendly, medium angle stuff, and it was fantastic, they felt like the 'new 98' in that environment, very quick yet capable.  I would like to ski them at Squaw, to see if I would still like them or find them wanting like Alexzn did...

post #28 of 30
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the links.

I was not aware of the shops from the supporters of this community. Definitely some really good deals, seems like a very good way to go.


I have a work trip scheduled to Chile during the second half of August, and I'll have the opportunity to ski for a few days as well. Although the variety of demos and rentals down there is not that great, I'll see if I get to demo any of the skis suggested on this thread before my final decision.


Would the Marker Griffons be a good option for the mid-fats?

I have the Tyrolia Railflex, and I love the possibility of changing their position using a coin. (I use forward on hard snow and center on soft)  But I guess they are also on the heavy side...



post #29 of 30

TT's or FKS/looks. these have become my favorite bindings.  Heres FKS14. great binding. Again, when you buy from someone here, they will help with proper equipment and setup. 





post #30 of 30
The lords were my 1 quiver til I just pulled the trigger on some on3p's. I think they (the lords) were well suited to all mountain, but when I was searching I heard nothing but raves for the pb&j and on3ps i ended up with.

I have griffons on the lords and have had no issues though I'm about 190lbs. The fks are awesome but significantly more expensive. If money isn't an object def get them.
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