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Dialing in Forward Flex on Rossi Experience 130

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
Hi Boot Guys/Gals I bought new boots based on fit/features, as they were the narrowest all-mountain boots I could find with rubber non-slip soles for boot-packing and generally safer non-skid walking around (without cat-tracks).

This Rossignol Experience Sensor 130 is my new boot:


My concern is that I am expecting them to be a little stiff for me in forward flex for all terrain skiing, and I'll probably want to soften them a bit. I would probably try removing one or both rear rivets/bolts if that makes sense. Is it more advisable to remove only one, and if so which one (upper or lower)? 
My current boot is the Rossi B-Squad Composite 120, and it's slightly stiff for me when bump skiing - I'm 170 pounds, 5' 10". It's packed out for the third time now due to starting wider than optimal, and I've used boot-board bontex shims and stick-on pads from Terry (Slidewright) already. Shell fit (no liner) is 1.5 fingers (3/4") space, but the cushy liner packs out further and further every 30-40 days. I had the same exact issue with my previous Nordica Speedmachine 110 packing out several times due to starting new too wide for me and having a pretty cushy liner, but the forward flex was fine! The Rossi 120 was never softened, the Nordy 110 was always used in the stiff position, and the spoiler was removed from the Rossi 120.
I have a plain narrow low volume foot with no unusual bumps, and most narrow race boots fit perfectly and are comfortable. 
Thanks in advance for any advice on dialing this new set of boots in! 
post #2 of 10

1 go ski em

2 if they need to be a little softer try taking the top bolt out first (6% softer) if not enough put back in and try the lower one (12% softer) or both (20% softer)

3 if you like the boot softer, put the bolts back in and take the boot to a fitter who will cut the plastic and soften the boot for you without affecting the rebound or weakening the mechanical fixings between the shell and the cuff, yes this is not reversible but that is the reason for testing with the bolts first



remember to try a couple of different temperatures and don't just bas things on one very warm or cold day



post #3 of 10
Thread Starter 

Thanks so much for the GREAT ADVICE to try the 3 variations over different temperatures! Neat that that Rossi incorporated 6%/12%/20% softer with just bolt variations.


I take it though that you never want to ski long term with no bolts, and that variation is just for testing - and indication that cutting needs to be performed if that much softening is needed. Am I understanding that right? 


A number of years ago I had a set of the Crazy Blue Lange WC Fit 130 boots softened by having the lower boot side-vees irreversibly cut away along the dotted lines, and after the first cut/grind they were already too soft and became too tiring for me to ski. Needless to say I'm still a bit scared of cutting!

post #4 of 10

Your understanding is correct.  Removing the bolts softens the boots but also reduces rebound and other characteristics you may like.  However, I would say that softening by cutting and grinding although preferable is a slow step process, because as you already learned if you go to far the first time you're done.


INstead of cutting the "v" slots on the side first leave them for last, and reduce the height of the lower boot boot in the rear most area where the cuff locking bolts go through.  This method doesn't cause as much change as the slots do.



post #5 of 10
Thread Starter 
This all makes tremendous sense! I will try the new boots first in all bolt variations and in various temperatures before doing anything permanent. I don't want to adversely affect the rebound. Is leaving only 1 bolt out an acceptable permanent solution if that variation feels right, or better to always have both bolts in and more carefully cut/grind?

I do like the rebound I am getting with the Booster Straps on my current Rossi B Squad Composite 120 boots, which have had nothing done to them other than moving my custom cork Superfeet orthotics into them, removing the rear spoilers, and swapping the seat-belt straps for Booster Straps - though I have added interior volume filler shims and pads over time as they've packed out and also to keep them narrow. The only weird thing I have ever noticed with these boots is that about a half dozen times out of say 100 days, my Achilles tendon ached a little for about 10 minutes - I can't remember now which foot but it was pretty rare and very inconsistent. I wondered each time if I was maybe straining due to the 120 stiffness, plus I also noticed they felt a little stiff in bumps but skied OK - which are all why I'm concluding I may need to soften this new set. I never noticed my Achilles before with any other boot, or even when I've been skinning. Needless to say I didn't like that feeling I might be straining my Achilles. This was also my first boot with a white colored forebody, which I noticed as being colder in the toes on bright cold days due I think to less solar loading than most of my previous darker colored boots.

Anyway this all led me to start over and buy new All Mountain boots that are narrower, have grippy rubber heel and toe lugs, have some slight lateral cuff adjustment (just slightly knock-kneed), and hopefully darker - and so few choices with all that led me to compromise with maybe softening a yet stiffer boot.

Thanks again so much for the great insight into the boot science!
post #6 of 10
Thread Starter 

I skied on my new Rossi Experience 130 boots both days this past weekend and they seemed GREAT at around 20 degrees F. I have not touched the rear spine bolts so the flex is stock, but I removed the spoilers, aligned the cuffs, moved over my custom cork Superfeet insoles into them, and put my Booster straps on them. I seemed to be flexing them just fine on smooth terrain and small piled up mounds, but there were no decent moguls to try. These seemed better connected to my hips at turn initiation, and rebound felt perfect. I also never felt that weird achilles straining sensation that I had occasionally felt with my last boots - sure hope it stays away, and I think those prior boots had more ramp than these so maybe it was that.


So nice to be on snow again - THANKS for the help and definitely for the suggestion to Go Ski 'Em first!

post #7 of 10
Thread Starter 
Been skiing these boots for 22 days now and my coaches are happy with my skiing, always referring to how well I'm standing on my skis. I believe these have less ramp than my last boots and are helping that. The stiffness seemed only a little too stiff when it was 5 degrees F, and I noticed some arch ache and lower outer calf muscle ache for a few runs, and then that eased and was fine. I am still using them with the original full stiffness.

I am having a substantial leakage issue though, and I can see quite a bit of moisture inside every day (thru the transparent green shell) causing me to have to pull the liners at night which is very hard to do. Normally I just have to dry my boots on our Chinook dryer at night and NOT remove the liners. I am concerned that the liners will not hold up to all of this removal wear and tear as well. I am going to try using duct tape across the toe overlap. Any other ideas would be appreciated as they're skiing well and the only real issue is leakage?
post #8 of 10

should be no issue pulling the liners each night to dry, not going to affect them long term... if you have one of the very early production then you may have a pair without the feather cut in the mould to give a better seal, you could try a spot of silicon sealant around the toe dam if that is where the problem is coming from... in the past the only issue we have had was further up the overlap of the boot, especially if people were skiing with clips undone

post #9 of 10

If you can't resolve the leakage issue or simply want to pull liners anyway, which many fitters recommend you might want to try the Hot Gearbag as a warmer and a dryer.



post #10 of 10
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the thoughts. I pulled the liners and dried both the shells and the liners on my Chinook dryer at my ski house (a high end boot dryer that blows a copious quantity of room temperature air through snorkel hoses into boots for overnight drying). I try to avoid using heated dryers so as to not impact the integrity of the foam in the liners. Before I put the the liners back in this time I sprayed them with silicone spray, and also sprayed  the inside of the shells with silicone spray and they were quite a bit easier to put back together (though I would like to not do this every night). Once back together I cleaned up the outside of the toe area with Windex and applied a strip of 3M clear duct tape across the toe seal of each (mine have the rubber toe dams with feathered rubber strips). After skiing today there was less leakage, but still some snow/water is still getting in - it seems more so now between the 1st and 2nd buckles than the toe dam. I would say that there was around half the visible moisture ingress as before the tape.


I ski with my bottom two buckles pretty loosely buckled, and with my top two buckles pretty tightly buckled. I find this mitigates morning arch aches, toe numbness when standing around or riding the lift, and still holds me down in the boots fine (no heel lifting). I generally avoid using very tight lower buckles - and this sounds like it may be part of the problem with this boot. Again these are buckled and it takes some effort to snap the buckles shut, but not the more substantial effort that it takes to snap the upper two buckles shut. Both boots are leaking about the same, so I am now considering additionally taping the overlap between the bottom two buckles - which will be a hassle as I need to spread that overlap to get my foot in and out. Any other thoughts?

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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ask the Boot Guys › Dialing in Forward Flex on Rossi Experience 130