Please MA my video for some carving turns

nice skiing, youve come to the right place for advice, i was taught early this year that i wasn't extending forward and up enough when changing from one turn to the next and snatched at the turn to quick not being patient and the video took of me looked like your skiing, im no pro so im probably wrong in what im saying, but theres plent with very good advice and expeience

Ni Hao Tsung-Min and welcome to Epic!

I love your strong tipping and edging movements. You also are getting into some great angles on your left turns.

This pic shows a lot of separation between the lower body and the upper body. Your right turns show some of the same positions, but not quite as strong. This is high performance skiing! 

This is still a strong position, but we'd like to see the left turns and right turns with the same angles. Can you see how the upper body is closer to the same angle as the lower body in the above picture  (right turn) versus your left turn?

Can you see the difference in the shoulder tipping between the two turns? I like to see the shoulders level as an ideal (a little lean is ok) when you are at this point in the turn. So here your right turns are a little better than your left. Sometimes it helps to focus on trying to keep both hands at the same height off the snow. When you finish a turn and are going across the slope, make sure that your shoulders are level to the snow (uphill shoulder  higher than the downhill shoulder).

Here are a few more suggestions.

Can you see your rear end behind the heel piece of the bindings and your nose behind your toes? I'd like to see you taller at this point in the turn by bending your knees less, bending your ankles more and moving your belly button forward. The first suggestion is to

try skiing with your hands behind your back. If that feels uncomfortable, you need to move forward. The second suggestion is to try skiing without your backpack. 

The next thing is that you tend to get stuck in the same position while you are on edge. This is commonly called "park and ride".  In the picture above you are finishing a left turn and about to being a right turn. Your shoulders are facing in the same direction as your skis and your right hand is head of your left. I'd like to see the left hand further ahead of the right at this point and your shoulders facing more down the hill (i.e. to the inside of the new turn or where you are going). This concept is called turning into counter. Your shoulders should be facing the same direction as the skis only when both are pointed straight down the hill. 

Let's go back to the first pic above. Can you see how close your feet are together? As you go faster and get more dynamic it is ok to let your feet get a little farther apart. This will increase your balance and let you handle the higher G forces in these turns better. The other thing this will do is let you work your legs more independently. As you get into higher performance turns, you will find yourself getting into "long leg/short leg" positions where one leg is bent more and the other is straighter. You can start to see this in the second pic where your right leg is bending while your left leg is relatively straight. I'd like to see that happening in your left turns too.

Most of these things work together. If your are having trouble doing one of the suggestions, try the others and you may find that one suggestion automatically make another suggestion happen. It looks like you are already having a lot of fun on the snow. Maybe after this next season you'll be skiing better than the guy in the second clip!

Hi Tsung Min Lai

First off, nice skiing! Are you already in the APSI system?

I'd echo some of the points Rusty made about counter and getting rid of your back pack if you can. I'd like to see you making more progressive tipping movements as well, spending more time in the transition and less time just riding the shape of your skis.

I think a key thing to work on would be to try and see if you can start tipping your skis over using your feet and lower legs, before you move your hip and upper body inside. Currently a lot of your edge angle on your left turn is generated by pushing your inside ski forwards, then dropping your hip in, this is what leads to your turns being a bit static in some places, and then having a lot happening very quickly in others. On your right you use more whole body inclination which works to an extent, but the edge angle you can get is limited by the speed you are going, with some more angulation you would be able to tip and bend the ski more, making a less static turn.

A good exercise to work on lower leg tipping is railroad tracks (aka edge rolls), on gentle terrain try and move your skis from edge to edge, leaving clean tracks in the snow a consistent distance apart. This is a relatively low edge angle exercise, try not to move your hips very far inside the turn, just focus on using your lower legs. Once you can use your lower legs to initiate tipping, you can just flex your inside leg to create angles, rather than pushing it forwards out of the way. 

Tsung-Min,

The same movement patterns are there in the second clip. These things are hard to change. Changing your "natural" stance width is especially hard. It took me years to get rid of my "straight ski" stance width and it happened more as a result of learning other movements than just simply getting my feet wider.

Inclination without angulation is what racers do at the beginning of their turns. It can be very powerful. If you do this in the middle or end of your turns, balance is a lot more difficult and you have less power to control your skis. The trick is what movements you use to start your turns. The first part of that is what position you finish our previous turns in. This can become a "catch 22" where you can't do the most efficient movements to start a new turn because you have not finished your old turn in a position that enables those movements and you can't finish your next turn in the most efficient position because of the movements you used during the turn. I'm not saying your current skiing is "bad". I see that you can feel how good it is. But to get to the next level of performance from this level of skiing, we have to work on a lot of little things. It's hard to get from "here" to "there". These things are easiest to learn one step at a time, but they really only work to help your skiing when they are all put together. Which order you work on these is not important. Some are easy to do by yourself. For others, you will need some coaching help to learn the fastest.

If you get a chance to ski with Richard Jameson (the APSI alpine tech director) - jump (or should I say "hop") on it! 

Rusty what level skier would you say Tsung Min is in the 1 to 9 grading system you use in the PSIA ?
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRusty 

Tsung-Min,

 

The same movement patterns are there in the second clip. These things are hard to change. Changing your "natural" stance width is especially hard. It took me years to get rid of my "straight ski" stance width and it happened more as a result of learning other movements than just simply getting my feet wider.

 

Inclination without angulation is what racers do at the beginning of their turns. It can be very powerful. If you do this in the middle or end of your turns, balance is a lot more difficult and you have less power to control your skis. The trick is what movements you use to start your turns. The first part of that is what position you finish our previous turns in. This can become a "catch 22" where you can't do the most efficient movements to start a new turn because you have not finished your old turn in a position that enables those movements and you can't finish your next turn in the most efficient position because of the movements you used during the turn. I'm not saying your current skiing is "bad". I see that you can feel how good it is. But to get to the next level of performance from this level of skiing, we have to work on a lot of little things. It's hard to get from "here" to "there". These things are easiest to learn one step at a time, but they really only work to help your skiing when they are all put together. Which order you work on these is not important. Some are easy to do by yourself. For others, you will need some coaching help to learn the fastest.

 

If you get a chance to ski with Richard Jameson (the APSI alpine tech director) - jump (or should I say "hop") on it! 

Great skiing. You are a very good skier. I did not read anyone elses feedback so Im unbiassed. I think you are carving nice round and evenly shaped turns and you have good rhythm. Good upper body position and a nice way of holding your ski poles. Your stance is quite narrow but that is ok, sort of, because as you start skiing with bigger edge angles you will have to get a bigger vertical separation at max tipping angle. But hey, that will come in due time. What can you do to advance you ask. First of all, I would like for you to be a bit more forward oriented. Now you are hanging back quite a lot. Your back pack is not helping any. Basicly all you have to do is to tip yourself way more than you are doing now. You should be able to get your hip on the snow. Now you are too careful with your tipping. On such nice snow you should be able to risk falling. Push your limits. A good drill for you would be the bicykle pedal drill, long leg short leg. Flex your inside leg as much as you can and extend your outside leg.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsung-Min Lai 

 

So, I made turn unsymmetrically. Which one is better? Right turn or left turn? Or some part of right turn, some part of left turn? 

Great skiing...

I think Rusty and Jim Nailed it...

To make things more dynamic, I think yours turns on the skiers right towards the left show an ideal position for the end of the turn... whereas the turns on skiers right towards the left may be more ideal for earlier in the turn.... however they are both fairly static throughout. Perhaps you could think of combining the two. On your turns to the left the hip moves inside very nicely to create huge edge angles but if you could create this move a little more progressively towards the end of the turn the ski will load nicely and launch you into the new turn. On your turns to the right see if you can end with the same kind of hip angulation as your turns to the left.

Oh Yeah.... moving the your mass forward as you enter the new turn will also help. This should perhaps be the initial focus as it is a fairly easy fix and may even be at the root of some of the other issues.

Good luck!

You are a very good skier, and you might want to consider moving this to the ask a ski pro section (so that you avoid comments from people like me who don't know what they are talking about :P ).

But without looking at what other people have said it appears that you move side to side a lot during your transitions. The ideal is to move diagonally forward.  That will give you an excellent edge change and allow you to stay forward the entire time.  The second video looks better, but I think a little more commitment is needed.  When you can practice shifting your weight more down the hill either by extending and moving your center of mass diagonally down the hill or by tipping and shifting your center of mass diagonally down the hill (you could try planting your pole a couple of inches down the hill more, but since you are going for big gs turns you don't use your poles that much), this will put you more diagonally forward and more into that free fall zone to allow maximum steering and edging of your skis through the turn.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rossymcg 

Rusty what level skier would you say Tsung Min is in the 1 to 9 grading system you use in the PSIA ?
 

PSIA does not use a 1-9 system any more. We talk about beginner, intermediate and advanced zones. That said, under what most people used for a 1-9 grading system, level 9 meant all terrain - all conditions. There's not enough here to know for sure, but I suspect Tsung-Min would meet this criteria. I also suspect that there is enough here for plenty of people to disagree with me. This is why I like the zone system better. Whether one is an 8 or a 9, there are still things we can work on in our skiing. I'm a believer in "the higher up you get, the more things there are to work on" philosophy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRusty 

 I'm a believer in "the higher up you get, the more things there are to work on" philosophy.

 

Amen to that.

I agree that the OP needs more progressive tipping movements as a primary focus. His skiing exhibits lots of park and ride. Nice angles though.

With your weight that far back, you have to push your heels out to make the short radius turns. Your pole touches are the least of your problems. Can you see how the tips of your skis come off the snow at times? You must get your weight centered before you are going to be able to improve these turns much.

I recommend two drills for you:

shuffle turns

pivot slips

Shuffle turns are where you constantly shuffle your feet back and forth (change which foot is ahead of the other) all the way through the entire turn. You'll find that you will have trouble doing this just before you change edges. Eliminate the trouble and you will be centered at edge change instead of weight back.

Pivot slips will teach you the feeling of turning your whole leg underneath your hips as opposed to pushing your heels out to.

All your power is behind your feet. Get your feet underneath you. One other thing,use/move your hands/arms to guide you through the turn.

I see some different things happening. First, as most have said, it appears that your balance point is too far to the rear. Some have suggested that you move forward, but if that does not work for you, try bringing your feet back. This balance thing is large, and will affect many events during each turn.

I also noticed the difference in hand use between long radius turns and short/medium radius turns. In the GS turn, the new turn is being controlled by your hands coming together in front of you, and then causing the body to initiate the new turn. In the shorter turns, your hands are apart, and your body is CONSTANTLY moving forward down the hill. Try this: start in medium radius turns with hands apart in front of you as you do now. Gradually increase the radius of each turn bringing the SAME movement patterns into the GS turns.

This may help you to change your balance over your skis and provide a smoother turn entry.

It does not look like APSI posts their criteria for level 2 cert online. Presuming that it is comparable to PSIA's level 2 cert, in my opinion you're close enough to work for this goal and achieve it this season. But you really should be getting advice about this from someone who is more familiar with APSI certification. The beauty of the non-skiing parts of certification is that mastering them gives you the knowledge to know for yourself whether your skiing skills are good enough to pass. APSI has a Level 2 course that looks like a prerequisite for taking the exam. They also offer skills training days. Those events should tell you exactly what they are testing for in the exam. We've already given you some things to work on. Remember that the fundamental movements are also present in wedge turns and wedge christies. Working on those turns will also improve your free skiing/parallel turns. Regardless of whether your skiing is good enough to pass, one purpose of certification is to get you in the mode of improving your skiing. That improvement should not stop after you have achieved certification and so improvement should be occurring before certification as well. So even though you may have other areas that need more focus, don't neglect improving your skiing.

Hi,

You said bending ankle more and hips forward, not up. I agree, but I believe there is an underlying problem you need to address first. Watching your video, I noticed your first two turns were started with your shoulders. And once you got into rhythm, your turns were not finished in the bottom portion. These two things tell me you are too far back in your stance and you used to make "Z" turns, using the skis as a brake to slow your downhill speed. This is also evident from the amount and timing of the spray from your skis. In your turns, there is no shaping after the fall line; it is more of a diagonal traverse.

In my opinion, you need to change your basic stance by balancing more forward FROM THE ANKLES. Once you convince YOURSELF that you can, and will do it, you will find yourself shaping the bottom of the turns, and being more forward to start with, you will naturally have more forward flex in your ankles, and you will find less resistance in your mind to moving forward at the start of each turn.

This will not be an easy change. It might take a year or two before YOU BELIEVE that you can do it. I think you will find yourself more comfortable and your skiing to happen more naturally. Enjoy!

Ed

Always start your demo runs starting straight down the fall line.

Have you had your alignment checked? Maybe one of the bootfitters here can tell from this clip, but I can't tell if the slight unequal edging/leg alignment seen here is technique or mechanical. The "A" frame (no space between the legs from the knees to the hips) is hindering performance.

This is the reason you need to move your hips across the skis earlier in the turn. Leaning the upper body does not work to release the old edges and in extreme cases forces you to lift the new inside ski in order to place it on the new edge. Note that the tip of the inside ski is higher than the tail. I don't see this as evidence that you need to bend your ankles more. I think moving the hips across the skis will solve this problem.

Cowboy turns will either teach you a more efficient release movement or solidify this movement. Once you can do those, you will be ready to do White Pass turns to "own" the more efficient release movement.

You should also try doing a funnel drill (start with large radius turns and gradually shorten the radius into short in the fall line turns).

I would not call these "Z" turns.

Overall, you are well positioned for having the level 2 exam preparation process propel your skiing to the next level of performance.

Late add; i noticed the left knee abducting more than the right one in a lot of his short turns. It's almost like there is a right ski dominance (foot to foot weight) issue. What alternatives would allow him to get off that edge cleaner without lifting the right ski and maybe also allow the left ski to do it's job. I like the hip angles Rusty mentioned but I also really like the strong inside leg on his turns to his left. Looks stacked pretty well to me.

Bob I see you are viewing this maybe you could chime in, I'd like to read your thoughts...

Don

Alignment check is too check how you are balanced in your boots. If your legs and feet are not perfect then you can benefit from adjustments either inside or outside of the boot to help you achieve a neutral stance. For example, you could need to have lifts in the toe or heel or be canted (i.e. to have either the inside or outside portion of the foot lifted). People who are naturally knock kneed stand with their knees touching and the outsides of their feet higher off the ground than the insides of their feet. They should have their boots canted to achieve the best performance on skis. Bow legged people are the opposite of knock kneed. Their knees are wider apart than their feet. Many people have an unequal amount of bow leg or knock knee in each leg. If you are not properly aligned, it is much more difficult to keep your skis at equal edge angles throughout your turns. See the boot fitters forum for more information.

Cowboy turns are making turns with your feet wider than shoulder width apart. If you don't make turns with lower body initiation, your cowboy turns will be very awkward.

Those are White Pass turns. The ski off the snow is exaggerated and this demo shows too much leaning. Ideally, White Pass turns should look close enough to regular skiing to make you look twice to see that the "wrong" foot is lifted off the snow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsung-Min Lai 

I got a new pair of skis(HEAD I Titan 170) and footbeds. 

 

I focus on flex my ankle and transition in those days.

 

There is my new clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZkbp7ANsck
 

I think I get better than before.

Any feedback will be appreciated.

Thank you for watching this.

Try stopping the video during your transitions.  Do you notice how often you are stemming?  It is especially apparent during your shortest turns, but it is still somewhat present during your wider radius turns (though it is much better disguised).  The reason for this is that you don't actually tip your skis to get them on edge; instead you rely on hip movements.  The trouble is that you have to do "something" to get the hips to start moving, and especially in your short turns, that "something" is a push off.  In your wider radius turns, you are sometimes able to release the skis a bit and let the turn forces help move you into the next turn (along with some arm waving), but you don't get any angles until you drop your hip in.  The angles that you do get at that point are great and you have some good counter balance (at least on one side :)) but the end result is that you end up with fairly static skiing with limited control over turn radius (because once the hip moves in you lock up your radius is set).

If you want to improve your skiing, the biggest bang for the buck will be to learn how to correctly tip your skis.  That means you start every turn by tipping the foot corresponding to the direction you want to go.  Tipping of the foot moves the ankle which moves the knee which finally allows the hip to move into the turn.  The other foot just follows; you don't even think about it until you are established in the arc.  When you really understand tipping, every turn will be about moving onto the "little toe" edge and trying to lay the lateral side of your ankle on the snow.  If you do that, you can't stem and you can't a-frame.  The end result is that you will develop a level of precision that you don't have now.

For you, I'd suggest spending some time working on slow, two-footed releases.  On a moderate slope, stand with your skis pointing across the slope, twist your hips so you are facing down the fall line and slightly flex your knees.  Plant a pole downhill for stability (make sure you plant downhill of the heel piece of your binding so your pole is out of the way) and then tip the *downhill* ski to flat.  Don't worry about the uphill ski; as you tip your downhill foot, the uphill foot will eventually follow.  As the skis release and begin to slide, just hold your feet back and ride the flat skis until the tips begin to drop.  When you are comfortable, begin tipping the inside foot while continuing to hold it back.  It can be helpful at this point to slightly lift the tail of the inside ski; as this will ensure you are balanced on the outside ski and it will also help move you forward.  Continue to increase the tipping of the inside foot (ignoring the outside; it will follow) until the turn completes and the skis come across the fall line to a stop.  Repeat in the other direction, again to a stop.  As you begin to master this drill, you should be able to accomplish your turns within a ski length.  After you have done a bunch of these statically, you can try linking them.  Your focus when doing this should be on the movements of tipping as well as pulling the feet back.   

The trouble with skiing like yours (excluding your short turns ;)) is that on the surface it looks good.  Especially, if you take say, the turns at say :48.  The differences between real tipping and what most higher level skiers do can be very subtle, but in terms of effect they are everything.  It is the difference between knowing (and understanding) exactly how to make your skis do what you want, versus just letting whatever happens happen.  If you take the time to learn how to tip properly, it will pay off in every aspect of your skiing.