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Those dumb hands - Page 3

post #61 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post

You know your skiing better then me.  

But my point is more that too many "instructor types" strive to make these perfect, 100% controlled, never lose form type of skiing...that frankly is in reality static, slow, boring, low performance type of skiing.  Dont be afraid to get bent out of shape.  If you never get bent out of shape....you are not trying hard enough.  That is not to say one should be getting bent out of shape every 5 minutes...but.....if you are never losing form - that is likely worse, and will hinder your progress greatley.

Perfect linked turns is perfectly fine if you intend to ski perfectly groomed slopes at perfectly even horizontal attitudes (perfectly consistent fall line). And they're great for demonstrating rhythm to skiers that can't link 2 turns. But they're just one way of getting down the hill, and there are so many other ways to choose. I think beginning and intermediate skiers who focus too exclusively on perfect turns or "carving" can limit themselves just as badly as the self-taught heel-pusher limits himself.

I'd rather see beginning and intermediate skiers work on an automatic, robot-like consistency of hand position range. At their skiing speeds, hands out front can be maintained all the time. As speeds pick up and turn forces increase, they can learn a more open/wide hand position through no-poles runs where they focus on GS turns. Last season starting at week 3 of a 6-week program I used 18-24" length heavy synthetic ribbon pieces with the kids I taught, they had to hold the ribbon between their two closed hands, with the hands relatively parallel as if they were holding poles naturally for skiing. We would go down runs like this. At the end of the 6 weeks nearly all of the kids had improved hand discipline in their skiing, and were aware of it when we talked about skiing. I considered it a success!
post #62 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidFeet View Post

While watching skiers from the chairlift last weekend, I noticed a few who stabbed the snow in front of them with their poles.  It was as if they were attempting to stab a fish in the water.  They would stab down with pole baskets pointed ahead, pole would hit snow with its tip pointed downhill, then it would rebound hard.  The pole bounced right back up along the same path it went down.  Stab, Rebound.  I watched the hands.  Pole in fist with pole diagonally pointing down and ahead, hand goes down with the stab, stops hard as the pole makes contact, then hand rebounds back up along the same path as the pole.  The action was at the elbow - elbow opens to stab, elbow closes as pole rebounds.  Wrist absorbs the force.  I'm thinking this is carpal tunnel syndrome in the making.

 

Then I watched the race team's coaches skiing down.  What a difference in pole action.  They swung their poles with their wrists, they didn't stab them.   The basket of the pole would travel in a semicircle below a stable hand, with its tip swinging fore-aft, as if the pole were a pendulum hanging from the hand.  They were moving the pole this way with wrist action.  On the downswing, the pole would gently touch the snow and rise back up without any rebound, continuing along undisturbed in its arc.  The hand stayed quiet, no bouncing back up after a stab.  Pendulum arcs, not stabbing and bouncing.  Much more wrist-friendly.   Much more flow-friendly.

 

Oh, and those poles were out wide, as in the previous pics.

 

yeah, this is what I was doing (1st skiers, not the racers). I have become comfortable with lighter pole plants and better elbow position. But now I will focus on making those poles outriggers out to the side, palms down. Thanks for all the info and great pics for illustrating that point DD223.

agreen

post #63 of 63
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzledVeteran View Post


Perfect linked turns is perfectly fine if you intend to ski perfectly groomed slopes at perfectly even horizontal attitudes (perfectly consistent fall line). And they're great for demonstrating rhythm to skiers that can't link 2 turns. But they're just one way of getting down the hill, and there are so many other ways to choose. I think beginning and intermediate skiers who focus too exclusively on perfect turns or "carving" can limit themselves just as badly as the self-taught heel-pusher limits himself.
I'd rather see beginning and intermediate skiers work on an automatic, robot-like consistency of hand position range. At their skiing speeds, hands out front can be maintained all the time. As speeds pick up and turn forces increase, they can learn a more open/wide hand position through no-poles runs where they focus on GS turns. Last season starting at week 3 of a 6-week program I used 18-24" length heavy synthetic ribbon pieces with the kids I taught, they had to hold the ribbon between their two closed hands, with the hands relatively parallel as if they were holding poles naturally for skiing. We would go down runs like this. At the end of the 6 weeks nearly all of the kids had improved hand discipline in their skiing, and were aware of it when we talked about skiing. I considered it a success!

 

For me, working on my hand position is one more step in my focus to ski in a good position and being able to get back to that good position when I get thrown off a bit.   

The position I'm talking about is stacked, and dynamic. 

If my hand drops back, then I know I'm not in a good body position, but I also know that I have a place to return and am pretty sure I can do it without having to stop and regroup. 

 

I like the ribbon thing you did with the kids.  That is similar to what I was doing with a ribbon between my poles.  

Now, on a funk day, I can imagine the ribbon between my poles and usually get my mojo back. 

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