Off piste ski for a short 5'5.5" guy... how long can I go?

How much do you weigh?

A 167 might be fine for you, but if it was me and I was looking for a rockered off-piste ski, I'd be seriously considering something in the mid-170s.  Something like a 178 Rossignol S3, which isn't very stiff and has pretty ample tip and tail rocker, is likely going to ski shorter than the traditionally cambered 170 Hot Rod Tempest you tried out. So the 168 almost certainly not be too long for you.  It has less effective edge than the ski you're on now.  It would obviously be best to demo, but keep in mind the rocker profile and stiffness when you're comparing to what you've tried out before.

I'd recommend starting with your height.  At 5'5", that's 168 cm.  Since you are primarily focused on off piste terrain, consider that a longer ski may not be appropriate.  Longer skis are generally more stable at higher speeds but you will not likely be reaching those speeds off piste.  I think all the skis you list are in the right ballpark.  Ski something too long and you will know real quick.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmourati 

I'd recommend starting with your height.  At 5'5", that's 168 cm.  Since you are primarily focused on off piste terrain, consider that a longer ski may not be appropriate.  Longer skis are generally more stable at higher speeds but you will not likely be reaching those speeds off piste.  I think all the skis you list are in the right ballpark.  Ski something too long and you will know real quick.

 

I agree that I'd start with the 168, but I'm curious as to the rest of your post.  All of my off piste-oriented skis are longer than my on piste skis.  I appreciate the extra stability for possibly uneven snow/crud/small bumps much more than I do when I'm just staying on groomers, even if my speed isn't actually as fast.  My cambered carving skis are 175 and feel fine.  My previous pair was 170.  All three of my mixed/off piste skis are around 186 and I wouldn't want them shorter.

If you can, demo the Nordica Steadfast in a 170.  It has a 90mm waist, camber and early rise tip so it skis shorter than 170 and it's pretty light weight since it has no metal in it other than the edges.  It carves extremely well when you need it to but where it really shines is off the groomers.  I primarily ski trees, bumps, chutes and whatever other powder I can find and the Steadfast is my daily driver.   I demoed the Bushwacker and Prophet 90 and liked the Steadfast better than than either of them.  I'm 5'8", 150 pounds so I'm about your size.  

Of the skis mentioned, I am familiar with the Rossi S3 and Blizzard Bushwacker which are both soft and therefore suitable for someone 150lbs. or less. The Bonafide is likely too stiff. Keep in mind that the really popular skis and sizes sell out and will not likely be available at November sales that usually feature stuff from last year that nobody wanted. IMO buying based on price is not the way to go.

I'm 5'8" 150 high intermediate. I had a chance to demo the 173 Blizzard Bushwacker. WOW, what a ski!! It's light and easy to maneuver. It seemed good to me in mixed conditions(never tried powder yet but not good enough any ways). I hear good things about the Steadfast too. I think your height/weight anything between 168-173 would be fine.

What size S3 would you recommend for him?  I just picked up a pair of 186s, but they're for someone who's a good bit taller, though not that much heavier.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philpug 

Rossi S3, at 98 underfoot, which is a 7/8th size S7 could be a great choice for you. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfa81 

The S3 would probably have to be the 168cm, since the next one is 178cm. The blizzard though have 173cm skis which could be a good option but looks like they are not too much of a rocker compared to the S3, the Line Prophet is another one that has a 172cm, and I know that the Line Prophet 90 at least at 165cm was an easy ski to handle when I did a demo on it some time ago on a day after a 6" of fresh snow.

 

Now after all your thoughts on going longer with rocker skis I`m starting considering going to around 170cm, so the Kung Fujas is another option at 169cm.

 

Someone was talking that could be hard to find a ski in november since they will be pretty much left overs from this season, I will take my chances but not looking into making a bad purchase if I can`t find a good one, I can leave the place with no skis and go get one at full price if I had to...

 

I`m hearing nothing but good things about the Bonafide and the S3, but the comment from DanoT that the Bonafide could be too stiff for my size concerns me, even though I`m kind crazy aggressive when I`m skiing and that`s why I`ve had some really cinematographic falls :-) do you think that could be a problem for me?

 

Right now I`m leading towards Bonafide 166cm/173cm, S3 168cm, Fujas 169cm and Prophet 98 165cm/172cm. and I`ve seen all those skis on local shops a few weeks ago when I was buying boots! Maybe they will still be there :-) 

 

I heard from a friend that early season discounts go around 30% even for current season in this case 2013 skis, so I might be able to get a good deal anyway

This is why I recommended the Kabookie, since its Blizzards softer version of the Bonafide for the back country. IIRC its a similar build to the Samba, which is the women's version of the Bonafide.  

This also leads me to a question about the Dynastar Cham 97.  I have not been on it, but hear great things about it for lighter people.  I really need to try that one. 

The lack of info on the Kabookie is frustrating. If it's a scaled up Bushwacker, could be a superior alternative to the S3, and for lighter skiers, to the Bonafide. Except that the initial mini reviews seemed to stress it's for sidebounds/touring, which is a (to my mind) a signal for very light, potentially unstable in rough snow, not a scaled up Bushwacker. If it's a male topsheet version of the Samba, then it is a scaled up Bushwacker. Guess we'll wait for the fall... 

Hmmm...  I'm a little taller than you (5'-10") but lighter (140 lbs).  I ski a 170cm ski now but have been able to comfortably ski 181cm off-piste oriented skis.  I think you will be able to handle a 173 length just fine, especially with any skis with rocker/early rise.

There are already a lot of good suggestions.  I've also liked some lighter models like the Fisher Watea 98 or Big Stix 98.   Ask 10 people here and you will get 10 different opinions (often from one person).

MF, you mentioned you are planning to buy early and won't have a chance to demo.  You are getting a lot of good suggestions here and clearly becoming more educated about what makes one ski different from another.  My suggestion is be patient and be flexible; if you happen to see a good deal on an appropriate size of a good ski at the fair/ski show/swap meet, or at any other sales event, jump on it. Otherwise be patient.  If you are absolutely committed to buying at the November fair/sale/swap meet, you are putting a lot of pressure to buy right then and there.  My feeling is that buying decisions are best made without that urgency.  Absolutely go, see, ask questions.  Use the opportunity to figure out which merchants you would rather build a relationship with.  

There is no reason that you can't demo a few different models early in the ski season, then figure out which models feel the best to you.  Yeah, we all want to start out the season on new skis, get over it.  Early season conditions often don't favor the new skis that people buy and are stoked to try. 

Also don't overlook the gear swap items in the marketplace forum here on Epic.  For example: http://www.epicski.com/t/111746/salomon-bbr-8-9-166-176-brand-new-299-00

or

http://www.epicski.com/t/111665/selling-all-my-2011-2012-demos

In a year like this one, I would image that every ski shop will have some good deals on good late-model inventory.

Well, since you know that every ski shop is going to say that every ski (or whatever ones they happen to have in stock) is a great ski, take that knowledge and see which shops really are good.    If they're good, they should know that their job is to learn about you and your needs rather than sell you on any one particular ski.  If they're good, they're learning how to make you a loyal, long-term repeat customer.   Buy from those guys.

Good luck, and let us know what you eventually get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfa81 

I`m getting more and more curious about the Kabookie, seems to be the one ski to go look for considering what I`m looking for...

Try Watea 94/98. they are light and very nice for the deep days, chopped up powder... This ski get less love than they deserve (for some weird reason I'm still trying to figure out) and you can get them for some silly money... No metal, wood core, carbon I-beams for torsional stability

I'm 5'7'' 180lbs and ski 2010-11 Watea 94@170cm with no early rise, traditional camber. I use them pretty much every day on Mt Hood except really hard days when AC3 tanks are more appropriate :) They are pure joy in soft snow, proved that on Mt Bachelor during end of March-beginning of April storm 

Vlad

I am 5'6" weighting around 157lbs.  I ski the K2 coomba at 172cm and love them.  I would not consider anything shorter, and I ski lots of powder and tree runs.  I have tried 174's but I feel a little uncomfortable in tight trees with them.  Especially with any type of rocker I believe you would not want to go anthing shorter than a 172, and if you are a  little uncomfortable with them at first you will grow intothem very quickly.  I ski off piste and b.c. quite a bit and I find them easy to skin on and they are great on the down. they are  102mm underfoot and give great floation for a quy our size, and if there is a lot of fresh powder, on resort, I will go to my 172cm K2 Pontoon.  Good luck.     

If you do a search on EpicSki, and/or look at the tags on the right side of this thread, you'll see EpicSki Product pages and some reviews of the skis you're talking about.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfa81 

I haven`t heard about the Fischer before, looks like it doesn`t show up on searches when you are looking for mid fats... thanks for adding another suggestion!

 

Here is some information I got from the Blizzard sneak peak at their facebook page, they position the Kabookie between bushwacker and bonafide, it has pretty much the same construction/materials as the bushwacker but the shape/size of the bonafide. It appears to be a more forgiving ski, lighter might be around 150g less than the bonafides same price as the bonafide.

 

Really curious about this ski... but I don`t wanna get too much into it, since I need to consider other options as well...

 

 

Bonafide

Lengths………………………	166, 173, 180, 187 cm
Sidecut………………………	133-98-118 mm
Radius………………………	21.0 m (180 cm)
Weight………………………	2,050 g (per pair @ 180 cm)
Binding………………………	Flat
Construction………………………	Sandwich Sidewall  Titanium  + Woodcore  + ISO-Core  + Bamboo  + Titanium
Technology………………………	Flipcore 3D, Sidewall
Camber………………………	Tip &Tail Rocker,  SlightCamberUnderfoot
MAP………………………	$699.99

 

 

Kabookie

Lengths………………………	166, 173, 180, 187 cm
Sidecut………………………	133-98-118 mm
Radius………………………	21.0 m (180 cm)
Weight………………………	1,800 g (per pair @ 173 cm)
Binding………………………	Flat
Construction………………………	Sandwich Sidewall  Titanium  + Woodcore  + ISO-Core  + Bamboo  + DoubleQuadrax
Technology………………………	Flipcore 3D, Sidewall
Camber………………………	Tip &Tail Rocker,  SlightCamberUnderfoot
MAP………………………	$699.99

 

 

Bushwacker

Lengths………………………	159, 166, 173, 180 cm
Sidecut………………………	125-88-110 mm
Radius………………………	19.0 m (180 cm)
Weight………………………	1,825 g (per pair @ 180 cm)
Binding………………………	Flat
Construction………………………	Sandwich Sidewall  Quadrax  + Woodcore  + ISO-Core  + Bamboo  + DoubleQuadrax
Technology………………………	Flipcore 3D, Sidewall
Camber………………………	Tip &Tail Rocker,  SlightCamberUnderfoot
MAP………………………	$599.99

 

on a side note, I noticed for the first time that Blizzard/Tecnica have some sort of partnership, I see that tecnica has bonafide, cochise, bodacious boots that have the same color/design as the skis... so a little bit of google research and the Tecnica Group actually has Tecnica/Blizzard/Nordica as well as a snowboard and a inline skate company

What you seem to be looking for is what most manufacturers call a free ride ski--the bonafides, bushwhackers, s3's and line prophets 98 (although line calls them all mountain), are all good options. I wouldn't go narrower than about 95.  170ish in length should be fine. Most people ski a longer ski in powder than on the groomed--for better flotation.  You're making very rapid progress in you're skiing if you're liking powder and trees in your first season--you might be able to go a little longer and pretty soon you'll be looking for something over 100 in width. I agree that you should demo if you can--shops will usually let you apply some demo cost to a purchase.  New skis start out discounted--no one every pays msrp, and then get discounted mid season, and then again late season if any are left.  Usually popular skis sell out, but in your lengths you might get lucky late season.  A lot of people buy skis on line, if they know what they're looking for, but if you have warranty issues you usually have to go through the shop, so I recommend buying from a shop. Also most shops mount the bindings for free if you buy skis from them. And there aren't that many discounts on line--the manufacturers try to keep everyone selling for the same price.

The skis you'll be looking at will come without bindings, and the binding will usually be mounted flat--without risers--for the kind of skiing you like. Skis in this class have some degree of rocker in the tip and traditional camber of some degree under foot.  Given similar dimensions and camber/rocker profile skis will mainly differ by stiffness, which is hard to without skiing them.  In general though skis with no metal than skis with a titanium layer, which are softer than skis with two titanium layers. 

Skis with rocker-- the tip and sometimes the tail turning up more and farther from the tip than traditionally--ski shorter on the groomed than traditional skis because less ski is in contact with the snow, and they ski shorter in powder because the rocker makes them easier to turn. You will definitely want a longer ski than the RocX you have now.It's getting hard to find an all mountain or free ride or big mountain ski that doesn't have some degree of tip rocker at least. Pretty soon calling a ski rockered will make as much sense as calling it shaped or parabolic (if you don't know what I'm talking about don't worry about it.)