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Boot Doc comfort foam liners -footbed underfoaming

post #1 of 7
Thread Starter 

Using Instaprint footbeds, and after having the Boot Doc liners soft foamed it definitely feels like I have a higher ramp angle and a slightly different feel to the footbeds especially under one arch, and in some mid and forefoot areas.  Shop did not have me use a harness or grab bars in the thought that the tongue (foamed first) would hold the foot down.  Notice that under the footbed there is some foam, and according to their website 'A partial under foaming of the liner base allows for optimal stability and an consistent transition from footbed to foot'. Am wondering if a harness really should have been used to counter this foam pressure?

 

Has anyone has dealt with this before and what issues I should be concerned with, and if it is of enough concern to try to make adjustments (how?) or ask for a redo?

 

Thanks

post #2 of 7

I don't know exactly where to start with this but I'm dubious about the benefits of making a custom footbed to help foot alignment and then altering its alignment by having it sit on a bunch of foam.

 

Lou

post #3 of 7

I would probably have to see the liner to tell for sure but I have two questions. How do they feel when you go skiing? 

 

Still feel like you are to far forward?

 

Are they uncomfortable?

post #4 of 7
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou Rosenfeld View Post

I don't know exactly where to start with this but I'm dubious about the benefits of making a custom footbed to help foot alignment and then altering its alignment by having it sit on a bunch of foam.

 

Lou



In addition to this it is also filling under the area under the arch with soft foam.  While it is soft I wonder if it would also be effecting the mechanics of the footbeds ability to flex.

 

I don't really understand the reason for it, though with a cheap stock footbed I could see it giving some needed support but I would find it strange to do this combination. Is there an issue that the foam exerts enough preasure on the top of the foot that they would want to counteract it with a similar preasure from below (the last time I had foam boots was probably 20 years ago with harder foam and cork superfeet, so deflection of the arch would not have been an issue since it was blocked under the arch)?

 

Thanks

 

post #5 of 7
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strolz_Boot_Guy View Post

I would probably have to see the liner to tell for sure but I have two questions. How do they feel when you go skiing? 

 

Still feel like you are to far forward?

 

Are they uncomfortable?


When I first put them on they feel a bit strange still underfoot (I've got about 12 days on them now). The right arch feels more 'full' and the boots ramp angle makes them feel like there is a lump of snow under the heel.  I feel like I'm standing more on my forefoot and my toes are slightly more  against the front than my old liner. Standing around in them is a lot more fatiguing.

 

They don't feel that odd when skiing, but I would say that my forefeet feel more sore than before and  before starting a run I do feel the need to punch my shin into the tongue to put my foot back. When skiing I suspect I am in a bit more flexed position than I would typically be (more butt back and shoulders down?)  and I think my knees are a bit sorer, which makes me think I'm trying to readjust a bit back to make up for my knees being ahead?  The heel lock makes them superior to my old combination, and on softer snow they work well, however i don't think I'm steering the skis around as well as I should, and recently I was out on some steeper white asphalt with some stiffer skis that typically I really have fun on (Blizzard supersonics) and I felt back on them, not able to steer them into making as  short of turns as I'd expect and not getting the edge hold I'd expect.  For the edge hold I suspect that might be from the softness of the foam underfoot, but it could be a stance thing as well as I've got a problem with a couple of joints.

 

Comfort wise, not getting any major hot spots underfoot, though I have an issue with the 2 outside toes on my left foot going numb still.  This may relate to some excess preasure in the 6th toe area, and I wonder if this preasure is in turn related to the ramp angle as the shell had been stretched to make them comfy in my old liner.  Have some issues with the upper in that the sides foamed under the tongue somewhat giving a bit of a lump on the inner shin.  Also there is quite a bit  of foam around the ankles, so the upper cuff is not that tight on the calf, which may also explain some of my edging issues.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Thanks

 

post #6 of 7

From your description of a lump under the tongue it sounds like they may not tightened the buckles tight enough when foaming which would have caused foam build up under the tongue. After the foam starts to flow around the foot you need to tighten the buckles pretty tight to compress the foam and to keep the foam from flowing under the tongue. With the combination of not using crab bars (as discussed in your initial post) these things could cause issues.

 

Disclaimer: the Internet is a great place to discuss issues however without seeing the boots this is only my speculation and best guess.

 

 

post #7 of 7

Canadian Quad,

 

Better late than never.....

 

I was the first importer of BootDoc foam liners into the United States and since 2010 I have injected hundreds of

BootDoc foam liners with a very high success rate.

The original version of the BD foam liner did not allow foam under the foot area. It was finished like a stock liner with

a Strobl last. The feedback from the first few seasons was that the heel was not getting locked down sufficiently.

The liner was comfortable, but not 'grippy' enough in the heel pocket. BD turned to Strolz's liner concept where

foam is allowed to seep under the foot, if necessary, to improve heel grip. Strolz boots, because their heel area is

designed to tolerate a wide range of heel widths, must use a wider than normal internal heel width. Therefore the liner must take

up the slack to provide substantial heel hold down. Allowing foam to penetrate just slightly past the base of the heel

generates enough pressure to improve the fit.

Strolz, like any other good fitter, prides themselves in their footbed production, so they sell a full custom footbed with

every boot. During the fitting process the footbed is fitted into the liner precisely so that no extra foam will pass under

the arch area or directly under the heel.

This is also the case with BD liners. If the footbed is interfaced properly with the liner, and the customer is clearly seated into

the heel pocket prior to foaming, very little if any foam will seep under the foot. It is not always necessary to use

a harness or pull down handles to foam a BD liner. It is recommended to do so if the customer is lightweight, but most

people over 150lbs will not need to pull down during the process.

I spent nearly two weeks at BD's headquarters in Liezen Austria this summer, and one of the tests I experienced was the

difference between the two types of liners. The Strolz type lasting we clearly superior to the Strobl lasting that was produced

previously when came to providing improved heel grip.

But at the request of the North American market, BD will produce a new Comfort Fit liner with a Strobl lasting that does not

allow foam to seep under the foot. It willhave a little bit less heel grip, but the liner is oriented to the recreational skier looking for

a relaxed custom fit.

The strange underfoot feeling you are experiencing can be corrected with an acetone injection in the affected area.

BD foam is acetone sensitive and can be soften by injecting a small amount and then massaging with a ball peen hammer

to break down the foam.

If you have any other questions regarding the BD liners you purchased, please let me know and I can help you get them resolved.

 

Regards,

Brent Amsbury

C.Ped.

Park City Ski Boot

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