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Rossignol S7 - Where Does it Fit?

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 

I know the Rossi S7 is somewhat controversial.  A one-time revolutionary ski from a mainstream shop.  Last year they completely sold out before the season ended.  Now they seem to be in the bargain bin at every shop.  What gives?  Did Rossi overproduce the ski and now has a huge inventory to sell-off or is it really just a case of this ski being long in the tooth after only a few years in production?  Too much crossover in the current Rossi line?

 

I know there are many other skis out there in this same category.  What are the S7-killers out there and at the current prices, should the S7 still be in the running for someone looking for this type of ski?

 

FWIW, I took this ski out recently for half a day, and while I was only able to experience it mostly on groomers and a few stashes of soft snow (nothing deep and/or steep), I was pretty impressed with it's front side capabilities, so much in fact, that I could almost see using this as a western daily driver.  I was not able to put it to the test in the conditions it was designed for, but was impressed none the less.  I would like to try out some other like-minded skis, but the aggressive price drops are intriguing.

 

 

post #2 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by elduderino View Post

  Last year they completely sold out before the season ended.  Now they seem to be in the bargain bin at every shop.  What gives?

 

FWIW, I took this ski out recently for half a day, and while I was only able to experience it mostly on groomers and a few stashes of soft snow (nothing deep and/or steep)...

 

<snip>  I was not able to put it to the test in the conditions it was designed for

I'd say the fact that it really hasn't snowed very much any where in N.America except the PNW and BC, where even they have had long-ish periods of no new snow would be the reason 'Powder Skis' are on sale now.

 

The S7 remains in Rossi's ski line for next season, I would say it is still an excellent ski for what it is. A quick turning, super maneuverable ski that floats like a cork. There are newer skis that might be better for a more aggressive skier in soft snow... OK there are better skis, but the S7 is a great ski for the middle of the bell curve.
 

 

post #3 of 21

It's still a great ski; it is intentionally designed to be fairly soft in longt flex. there is no ski that is made better, or designed better, just skis made differently, different flex, shape, profile. In that category, though none more numerous on the hill than S7, are Bentchettler, DPS112, Super7, Squad 7, Shiro, Watea 114, Praxis Protest, to name a couple.

post #4 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by davluri View Post

It's still a great ski; it is intentionally designed to be fairly soft in longt flex. there is no ski that is made better, or designed better, just skis made differently, different flex, shape, profile. In that category, though none more numerous on the hill than S7, are Bentchettler, DPS112, Super7, Squad 7, Shiro, Watea 114, Praxis Protest, to name a couple.



Pretty much agree,

There are just a lot of other skis doing S7 better than the S7. That and I really feel that Rossi has not paid attention to the quality in their freeride ski's. But I'm picky.

 

Not to mention there are a ton of ski's on the wall that should have been sold out months ago. I picked up a 192 Bent Chetler at a discount last week. Normally this ski should not even be on the wall at this point in the season.

post #5 of 21

I think Whiteroom hit the nail on the head - it's about how aggressively you normally ski.  Most of my friends who are stronger skiers all agree that the S7 is too easily "crushed".  It really crumbles at speed on the feet of more accomplished skiers.  The Super 7 improves things a "little" bit, but for 2013 the new Squad promises to be the answer (although Rossi has tweaked the shape a bit on that model).

post #6 of 21
Thread Starter 

What are some suggestions for a similar type ski that are priced to sell?

post #7 of 21
post #8 of 21
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecimmortal View Post

Billygoat's are on sale.

 

http://on3pskis.myshopify.com/collections/2011-2012-skis/products/2011-2012-billy-goat



How does the BG compare to the S7 in harder snow?  Also, where does the Vicik fall in comparison?

post #9 of 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by elduderino View Post

What are some suggestions for a similar type ski that are priced to sell?


 

I have 6 friends who ski the S7.  I ski the Icelantic Keeper, along with one of my other friends.  The S7 skiers are starting to complain about the skis deficiencies, while my friend and I are falling more in love with our Keepers. Similar shape, but the Keepers have more camber, lower rise rocker, and not much of a pintail.  If you can find last year's Keepers they are identical to the new ones, except for the topsheets.
 

 

post #10 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noodler View Post

I think Whiteroom hit the nail on the head - it's about how aggressively you normally ski.  Most of my friends who are stronger skiers all agree that the S7 is too easily "crushed".  It really crumbles at speed on the feet of more accomplished skiers.  

Well yes and no. I get weary, in all honesty, about "aggressive" and "speed" being automatically equated with better skiers. Yes, obviously a good skier tends to move at higher speeds because they carve more, have better balance/recovery skills, and because speed is entertaining. But mediocre skiers also tend to ski fast, sometimes faster than good skiers, largely because they can't control their gear at lower speeds and yep, they equate skiing fast with being good. Most of the folks whizzing past you on runs, butts back and arms out, edges all over the place, in fact are intermediates. Truth. So good skiers often like to ski fast. But skiing fast not equal to being good. 

 

More to the point, the basic plain vanilla S7 will, uh, "crush" many of the other skis mentioned in tight lines, trees/pillows, including all the other Rossis, where what's relevant is maneuverability at lower speeds, being able to scrub speeds on a dime, reshaping a ski's radius at 20 mph. At those speeds, a lot of metal just makes the ski a PITA to move around. I will also note that the U.S. Ski Team does a lot of low speed work to develop control. As do Level III's. If OP's actually a strong skier, he should try carving at a walking pace, then go back and look at his tracks. 

 

A lot of this "oh, the S7 is so over" IMO is mostly about fashion. It's still the most common powder ski out there because it does make the most skiers happy. We just hate to ever think we're typical or normal. We're all exacting, aggro skiers who need to charge...wink.gif

 

 

post #11 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by elduderino View Post



How does the BG compare to the S7 in harder snow?  Also, where does the Vicik fall in comparison?


Obviously the BG is a more soft snow biased ski, but it it's quite fine on the groom. The Vicik has a much longer effective edge. Less turny than the BG, and of course 12mm skinnier. So not really comparable I like the Vicik for hauling ass and making long turns.

 

Though I currently don't ski either. I have spent time on both.

 

post #12 of 21
Thread Starter 

The JJ seems to come up a lot in comparisons with the S7.  As does the Bent Chetler.  Anyone care to comment on those entries?? smile.gif

post #13 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by elduderino View Post

The JJ seems to come up a lot in comparisons with the S7.  As does the Bent Chetler.  Anyone care to comment on those entries?? smile.gif



I am on the 192 Bent Chetler right now. I chose it over the Super 7 for a couple of different reasons:

 

More even/stiffer flex profile

More modern rocker profile..Less abrupt

A little bit wider

Little bit longer turn radius

 

I also think overall Atomic's construction and overall finish is superior to what Rossi is doing in their freeride ski's.

post #14 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post
But mediocre skiers also tend to ski fast, sometimes faster than good skiers, largely because they can't control their gear at lower speeds and yep, they equate skiing fast with being good. Most of the folks whizzing past you on runs, butts back and arms out, edges all over the place, in fact are intermediates. 

 

 



On blue groomers, sure. But not in deep snow, on black runs.  They will fall. They will make it farther down the hill on an S7 than on a carving ski, though, lol.

 

I'm one of those super cocky aggro skiers rolleyes.gif who found the S7 a bit "crushable" in crud. I sold mine and bought the DPS 112, granted in a longer length (which helps), but so far I have found that it is much superior in skied-out snow. And the number of different turn shapes you can make, wow. It's like magic. I've only had them out three days, though, so I'm sure I'll find some shortcomings eventually.  I know many people enjoy the S7 in crud, too, but for whatever reason, I was dissatisfied.

 

post #15 of 21
Thread Starter 

Where does the Head Inferno play in the grouping?

post #16 of 21

El Dude,

 

You really need to try a pair of what interests you.  If you liked the S7's, grab a pair at the sale price.  As someone who has ski and owned just about every ski mentioned so far in this thread, I would go out on a limb and say that none of these twin-rocker shapes are perfect.  All have a distinct style or condition that they excel in and all have some drawbacks. 

 

If you are not a hard-charger, get 6" or more of new snow often, ski trees, and enjoy an playful, fun ski...then grab the S7's.  I have yet to find a more playful powder-oriented ski. 

 

I think that it is interesting that the S7 gets panned over by some as "outdated".  Yet with the addition of the Super 7 (I ski the 195) and the Squad 7 (for 2013) to the Rossi line, it's clear to see the evolution of the S7 design concept, but in other forms, aimed at other conditions and skier abilities.

 

Sometimes I wish that the S7 had a bit less of a pintail, but then it would likely lose that fun, loose feeling in the tight PNW tress I have come to love and start to feel more like a JJ (hooky in deep snow), which I hated.

 

Anyhow, find something before they are gone and post your own review to keep the stoke rolling.

 

post #17 of 21
Thread Starter 

^^^Good advice.  My plan was to try a few out in a few weeks in Taos, really looking for some other suggestions on what to demo.  Of course, the longer I wait the higher risk that what I like won't be available, but probably willing to take that chance rather than gamble on something.  There are a LOT of good skis to be had a great prices right now.


S7 was fun....would be interesting to see what might be MORE fun!

 

Rest assured, whatever I try and/or buy, I will be sure to post my review(s).

post #18 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecimmortal View Post



I am on the 192 Bent Chetler right now. I chose it over the Super 7 for a couple of different reasons:

 

More even/stiffer flex profile

More modern rocker profile..Less abrupt

A little bit wider

Little bit longer turn radius

 

I also think overall Atomic's construction and overall finish is superior to what Rossi is doing in their freeride ski's.


You've made many references to "inferior" quality control in various posts the last few days.  Could you elaborate?  

 

I know a whole bunch of people skiing this year's and last year's Rossi's in various models and nobody I know has mentioned word one about complaints.  Shop people haven't said anything either.

 

th_dunno-1[1].gif

 

post #19 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by elduderino View Post

Where does the Head Inferno play in the grouping?



IMHO, it's a different creature, but a very nice one that I know I prefer. Not saying anyone else should though. Just a great all around all mountain ski. Damp, stable, solid. Also very un and under rated. 

post #20 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post

Well yes and no. I get weary, in all honesty, about "aggressive" and "speed" being automatically equated with better skiers. Yes, obviously a good skier tends to move at higher speeds because they carve more, have better balance/recovery skills, and because speed is entertaining. But mediocre skiers also tend to ski fast, sometimes faster than good skiers, largely because they can't control their gear at lower speeds and yep, they equate skiing fast with being good. Most of the folks whizzing past you on runs, butts back and arms out, edges all over the place, in fact are intermediates. Truth. So good skiers often like to ski fast. But skiing fast not equal to being good. 

 

More to the point, the basic plain vanilla S7 will, uh, "crush" many of the other skis mentioned in tight lines, trees/pillows, including all the other Rossis, where what's relevant is maneuverability at lower speeds, being able to scrub speeds on a dime, reshaping a ski's radius at 20 mph. At those speeds, a lot of metal just makes the ski a PITA to move around. I will also note that the U.S. Ski Team does a lot of low speed work to develop control. As do Level III's. If OP's actually a strong skier, he should try carving at a walking pace, then go back and look at his tracks. 

 

A lot of this "oh, the S7 is so over" IMO is mostly about fashion. It's still the most common powder ski out there because it does make the most skiers happy. We just hate to ever think we're typical or normal. We're all exacting, aggro skiers who need to charge...wink.gif

 

 

 

I do wonder, though, if there isn't an element of weight involved.  

 

I weigh ~190#, probably more like 205# with boots and the pack that I nearly always wear.  For me, the regular S7 in the 188cm length does feel a bit "mushy" and does get bounced around a little in chopped-up snow and crud.  In untracked snow, particularly in trees and tight spaces, it's a grin-generating gas, but in deeper and choppier stuff I've left like I could overpower it a little.

 

I spent the last couple days of our recent snowmageddon skiing the Super 7 in the 195.  THAT ski is just a dream for me.  I can make it do any turn shape I want, from squishy slipper turns in trees and chutes all the way to what amounts to super-g turns in junk on big open spaces.  

 

The metal and additional stiffness of the Super 7 really make the ski work for me at my weight.  But for a more "average" weight skier, I think the regular S7 has proven to be a giant winner.
 

 

post #21 of 21

^^^^ Yep. Totally agree. At the end of the day, a good powder ski is all about flex and float, and the flex is always relative to your weight. I also ski the 188 S7, and at 165 lbs it doesn't feel mushy at all. Some sensitivity to crud in front, but nothing that knocks the ski around, and I'll take that as a tradeoff for maneuverability. 

 

The float part is I think where people get bogged down. It's really lift we're talking about; when the lift equals your weight, you float. And the lift is a function of not just surface area but attack angle of the shovel (thus rocker), velocity, and snow density. So the same ski, same skier, same speed, can float in denser snow, sink in lighter snow. Implication is that if your home mountain gets really light snow, you may need a wider ski. And since a wider ski will have a greater cross sectional area at mid-ski, it'll be stiffer - which will work against the need to flex a powder ski against the resistance of the snow to turn it - unless you tinker with the materials, make it softer. This is the physical explanation - I think - why folks in the light snow areas on average tend to like relatively softer wider powder skis, while folks in the denser snow areas are happier with a relatively stiffer and bit narrower ski. 

 

Also a good excuse to own more than one powder ski. biggrin.gif

 

 

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