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new skis for east coast skier: Atomic Smoke Ti or Fischer Progressor 800 ?

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

Hi,

As there are some really good deals these days, I'm looking around to buy some new skis.

 

I ski mainly in Québec (Massif), so really east coast conditions (ice, ....).  Powder is rare over here as you can imagine.

 

70/30 on/off piste, ski everything on the mountain (corduroi to icy bumps).

I'm more a technical than a 'power'skier, 6'1", 160lbs.

 

Am currently on Head XRC1000i's (170), which is a kind of ski I like (69 underfoot).

 

My budget is about 700$ max.

After some research, have my eye on 2 skis on which I can have a good deal: Fischer Progressor 800's in 170 or 175 (700$) and Atomic Nomand Smoke in 171 (500 $).

 

Things I am looking for: excellent edge grip on ice/hard pack, high speed limit but at the mean time some flex in the tips for going in the (hard) bumps.  Also would lik skis that are not too heavy underfoot.

 

Another ski that looks interesting is the Head iTitan, but would like to try something else than Head.

 

Comments that would help me make a choice would be really appreciated.

If I need to specify my needs more precisely, let me know.

Thx !

post #2 of 15

I have owned the progressor 8+ for 3 seasons now in a 170mm. I ski primarily at cannon, jay & sugar loaf. It is  a great utility ski for an east coaster. Good to excellent edge grip, no metal so pretty good in the bumps and very comfy ride. They like to turn and they quite stable but have their speed limit for sure. Now so good in anything over 4" fresh, since they are rather narrow, but for where I primarily ski, they have been great. I just upgraded to an Dynastar speed course in a 178mm and I am actually liking that ski as much if not better. Almost identical side cut and profie, yet a bit more stable and handles high speed with less much chatter. EVO.com has them along with the contact cross, which is another excellent east coast option for under $400 right now w/ bindings. I have no experience with head skis so cannot comment on those. Good luck

post #3 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Basil J View Post

I just upgraded to an Dynastar speed course in a 178mm and I am actually liking that ski as much if not better. Almost identical side cut and profie, yet a bit more stable and handles high speed with less much chatter.


Thx for the reaction.

How do the Dynastars handle in the bumps ?

 

 

post #4 of 15

They have a low profile tip, are longer and are a little more damp or muted than my fischers so it's not an apples to apple comparison. In small to medium sized bumps they are fine, in big bumps and deep troughs they are more challenging than the fischers, but still do quite well. The progessor is a little quicker and more nimble because it is a 170cm, the dynastar is better on steeps and higher speeds. If I bought the speed course in a 172cm, I think it would be a better performing all around ski than the fisher. It's close, I really love both of them and happily ski which ever ones are on my feet. Neither are great in crud, but for an east coast ski, with the right length, they are both excellen skis, and honestly if a progressor 8+ was available in a 175cm for $400.00 I would have snatched it, but iam quite happy with the speed course and highly recommend it for an east coast utility ski.

post #5 of 15

Eastern skier here, mostly VT. No experience with Head but I'm riding a new pair of Atomic Nomad Blackeye Ti's. For a reasonably skilled skier they're more suitable for eastern conditions than the Smokes in some ways. Being a bit stiffer they'll hold an edge better, chatter less at speed and give you more pop at the end of a turn. Unless you're in the bumps/trees all day/every day, I'd wonder if the Smokes might hold you back a bit.

 

The Ti layers do make the Blackeyes a bit more of a ski to handle, but they have some tip/tail rocker and I've had zero problems with them in the small-medium bumps I've skied so far. Even when the bumps were rock hard they never tried to throw me. They reacted fast and just as I wanted. My first impression in the shop was that they're heavy but they don't ski heavy, they ski quick but solid and they're a step or three above a lazy intermediate ski. They hold high speed turns and give you some energy back. The Smokes wouldn't do that as much, they'd be more forgiving, so it's a matter of what kind of skiing you prefer. For reference, I'm 5' 10", just 140 lbs, definitely a technical rather than a power skier, Level 8 on a good day. I'm on the 167s but I'd be fine on the 171s in all but very tight bumps or trees. Being slightly larger you'd probably be fine on 171s in either model.

 

For comparison, I've skied the K2 Richtor several times out West. That's a good all-around ski, very easy to handle in the conditions out there. It's not a hardpack ski however, I managed to find its speed limit on hard snow (or what Westerners call hard, lol). The Blackeye Ti's are a step up from the Richtors in terms of hard snow edgehold and stability at speed. The Richtors are a bit more forgiving in soft snow or bumps but they don't have much of "pop" at the end of hard charging turns. Turn transitions are easy rather than energetic.

 

Have fun whatever you choose!

 

post #6 of 15

Maybe it's a CT thing but I was thinking the Blackeye Ti also. Great all around waist width "82" and a little early rise rocker "Adaptive" makes it ski great in all conditions. Atomics have great grip on hard snow.You should be able to get a pair for around $500.00-600.00 USD this time of year.

 

I thought Le Massif got Powder often??

 

The Atomic Blackeye Ti in action last week at the Stratton on Snow Demo

StrattonOnSnow2012 086.JPG

post #7 of 15

Peter, glad to see you still think well of the Blackeye Ti's! wink.gif  Great guidance from you folks.

 

Good photo. You can see the outside tip rockering a hair but less than a fully rockered ski would. Adaptive Rocker offers enough forgiveness to make them a hoot in bumps/crud without seriously impacting hard snow/high speed carving. It's a good balance for Eastern conditions, at least for me.

 

To the OP, the Blackeye Ti's are great hard-snow carvers without quite being a race ski. You can drive a race ski through the end of a high G-force turn by pressuring directly through your heel - or even slightly behind - and they'll remain stable. The Blackeye Ti's are stable unless you drive them that hard. The instant you move the pressure point behind the center of your heel they'll begin to chatter. That's their limit. It's precise, predictable and easy to find (or avoid). Ski them just a hair less aggressively and they're bulletproof.

 

The Smokes and other softer skis will slide or chatter earlier of course, perhaps much earlier. More forgiving but less surefooted and less capable of taking your sking up a level. That's the tradeoff.

 

post #8 of 15

I'm in the same boat and the Blackeye's are at the top of my list but I also have a chance to pick up Blizzard 8.1's for significantly less than the Blackeyes , any opinions on the 8.1's vs the Blackeye's? 

I don't want to get too much ski for me ( Intermediate but looking to advance , like some speed but not super aggressive)  From what I've read Blackeyes may be geared towered level where I am now AND where I want to go    vs the 8.1's may be more toward where I want to go. 

Both seem a good fit for me but want to make sure the 8.1's won't punish me too much (vs Blackeyes)  while I'm progressing.

post #9 of 15
I think it's more about feel. I don't like the feel of Atomic skis -- at all. Fischers I like, though sometimes they're a bit on the skippy side of things (more antelope, less bison). The biggest differences I notice in skis today is feel, if you're talking about equivalent models/categories of ski. Once you have tried a few different skis with different feels, you can sort out what will work happiest for you. I tend to end up on skis that are damp and powerful, rather than light and springy. And I found Atomics to feel light but planky, which I didn't like at all. But I know a lot of people who love Atomic skis!
post #10 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzledVeteran View Post

I think it's more about feel. I don't like the feel of Atomic skis -- at all. Fischers I like, though sometimes they're a bit on the skippy side of things (more antelope, less bison). The biggest differences I notice in skis today is feel, if you're talking about equivalent models/categories of ski. Once you have tried a few different skis with different feels, you can sort out what will work happiest for you. I tend to end up on skis that are damp and powerful, rather than light and springy. And I found Atomics to feel light but planky, which I didn't like at all. But I know a lot of people who love Atomic skis!


So what DO you like then?

post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 

Thx, I will also look out for the Blackeye Ti (think it has wood core full length, contrary to the Smoke).

 

post #12 of 15

Fischer - WC RC Pro.

Atomic - G2 Race GS

 

Sure they may be a little stiff in big moguls but still manageable.  They make up for it making race-like turns on the hard pack. 

 

Unless that 30 % off-piste is in untracked soft and deep (at Massif??? not likely)  in thick trees.

post #13 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post

Fischer - WC RC Pro.

Atomic - G2 Race GS

 

Sure they may be a little stiff in big moguls but still manageable.  They make up for it making race-like turns on the hard pack. 

 

Unless that 30 % off-piste is in untracked soft and deep (at Massif??? not likely)  in thick trees.



Le Massif gets alot of snow or at has so far this year.

 

 

post #14 of 15

Pieter,

 

You have my take on the Blackeye Ti but Grizzled Veteran made a crucial point. I ought to have included a similar disclaimer, so shame on me. redface.gif

 

If you aren't confident that a particular brand suits your style, buying ANY ski blind is a crap shoot.  From experiences similar to GV's I agree that every brand responds differently. Some will bring your skiing alive, others may make you feel like a total dork. The only way to know which does what is to ski them.

 

Demoing may not even cost, many shops credit demo fees toward a purchase. In the long run the way to save money is to buy stuff that works. A bargain ski that doesn't make your feet smile is no bargain.

 

Demoing is also good fun. You'll learn something about skis and about your skiing.

 

post #15 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DouglySkiRight View Post

If you aren't confident that a particular brand suits your style, buying ANY ski blind is a crap shoot. 



Demoed some Atomics 2 years back, and was really blown away by their grip on ice (like being in rails....).  That's the main reason I'm interested in the brand.

 

By the way: also saw that Evo has extremely interesting deal on Dynastars Contact Crosses (not the Ti version): reviews I found seem to indicate this would be an interesting East Coast ski as well.  Any thoughts ?

 

I'll try do demo some in Austria (the flight leaves in 4 hours.....), where I expect heaps of snow (but no icy East Coast conditions....).

 

Thx again for all the comments

 

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