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Just tried 2013's Salomon 130 Custom Boot...

post #1 of 25
Thread Starter 

Very interesting - my bootfitter has a pair for himself for trial. Yellow and White (forgot to snap pics, but will post tomorrow unless someone else has already)

 

Entire lower of the shell custom fits similar to the Fischer Vacuum. Shockingly light in weight - also, very unusual was the feedback from the bottom of the sole - felt like I was wearing a slipper the boot "feels" so thin on the sole. Flex is light for a 130, but in the shop obviously...

post #2 of 25

I'm very interested in this boot, please post if you find out more!

post #3 of 25

I just bought a pair of these. I got them fit and tried them out for a day on the hill. They were about 90% correct but still needed a punch and a little stretch. I am going to try them again tomorrow. My feet are very tough to fit so I am happy with the fit process so far. Got my fingers crossed that this will be the ticket!

post #4 of 25

ps- my bootfitter said he is using these also!

post #5 of 25

I tried a pair of these on a couple of days ago and will get a pair. Boot was all black and 120 flex I think. The only reason I didn't go ahead straight away was the bootfitter was a bit uncertain on the correct procedure for moulding the boot and liner. The liner was a lace up conformable, very nice looking liner. Main question i have does anyone know the correct moulding procedure, do you heat liner and shell and at the same time or do you do liner first and shell after liner has been heat moulded? 

post #6 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by malski View Post

I tried a pair of these on a couple of days ago and will get a pair. Boot was all black and 120 flex I think. The only reason I didn't go ahead straight away was the bootfitter was a bit uncertain on the correct procedure for moulding the boot and liner. The liner was a lace up conformable, very nice looking liner. Main question i have does anyone know the correct moulding procedure, do you heat liner and shell and at the same time or do you do liner first and shell after liner has been heat moulded? 


If the boot was as you described, all black with a red and black Sidas Thermo liner, it was not next years Salomon X-Max. It is the Sidas Black Project boot.

 

The Black Project boots are built off of this year's X3/Falcon and Impact chassis with your choice of a Thermo or Foam Conformable liner.

They do not have the custom shell panels, so there is no cooking of the shell, just the liner. While the Salomon logo does appear on the boot it is badged as a Sidas Custom.

 

We sold the boot this year and did very well with them.

 

I find it curious that someone would be selling this boot and not know what it was or what to do with it.

 

Next year's Salomon X-Max is going to do very well, I spent much of the spring skiing in one. The shape has changed quite a bit and the foot has been moved further back in the shell, along with a variety of other changes. Less forward lean, no cuff alignment and better ingress/egress to name a few.

 

The Sidas Black boot will not change for next season and continues with the X3/Falcon last for one more season.

 

jl

post #7 of 25

Thanks for this I have found these boots on the internet now, had feeling the guy in the shop wasn't sure about the product, he was only a part time worker in the shop, which is why I didn't go ahead. I will wait for the for the custom shell. As these boots still were very tight and I not sure wether just heating the liner will relieve all the tight spots.

 

Is this sidas liner a similar concept and as moulded as a Intuiition liner?

post #8 of 25

Why no cuff alignment feature?

post #9 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by malski View Post

Is this sidas liner a similar concept and as moulded as a Intuiition liner?

The Sidas is an injection liner, it isn't heated. The shells have only the moldable panel - look at the current impact and X3 shells for reference.

You only get one shot with injection moulding and need to work wIth an experienced fitter.
post #10 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by roundturns View Post

Why no cuff alignment feature?


One of the features of the X-max chassis is the oversized pivots. This creates a stronger link between the cuff and clog for better transmission. 

 

if you are working with an average tibial angle, cuff alignment is not very important. If the tibial angle falls outside the average, cuff alignment can become very important.

 

For the record, Sidas makes a variety of aftermarket liners. Some are foam injected and some are thermo molded. The Black Project boot has the option of either or both

depending on the customer's preference. The Black Project boot does not have the Custom Shell panels that the Salomon versions have. With the X-Max, the whole clog (with the exception of the sole) can be baked and molded.

 

The boot can also be formed using standard punching and hydraulic methods.

 

jl

post #11 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by csr_jr View Post

Very interesting - my bootfitter has a pair for himself for trial. Yellow and White (forgot to snap pics, but will post tomorrow unless someone else has already)

 

A picture was already posted in the following thread: http://www.epicski.com/t/111635/salomon-custom-360-boots#post_1449756

post #12 of 25

 I am the lead boot fitter at a ski shop in Phoenix. Don't laugh. We are the third biggest shop in America.

 

The new Salomon x-max 130. Is easy to get on. Very comfortable. Actually large volume for my foot; in the fore-foot. Salomon is trying not to (continue) getting outsold by more comfortable boots. My background includes full-time employment by Salomon and past technical testing team member.

 

Here is what I find confusing. This boot does not flex like a 130; it is very soft. You must sole plane the boot for alignment; as there is no cuff alignment. Yet! the x-max 120 has removable soles which I am sure cant-ology will provide/produce replacement (angled) soles. This boot is SO large volume that if one is serious about having their foot held. They will have to choose a smaller last only provided by a real race version.

 

But for the medium to large volume skier with a fat for foot and wallet. This is the perfect solution. As long as they want a SOFT 130.

post #13 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoenixSkier View Post

 I am the lead boot fitter at a ski shop in Phoenix. Don't laugh. We are the third biggest shop in America.

 

The new Salomon x-max 130. Is easy to get on. Very comfortable. Actually large volume for my foot; in the fore-foot. Salomon is trying not to (continue) getting outsold by more comfortable boots. My background includes full-time employment by Salomon and past technical testing team member.

 

Here is what I find confusing. This boot does not flex like a 130; it is very soft. You must sole plane the boot for alignment; as there is no cuff alignment. Yet! the x-max 120 has removable soles which I am sure cant-ology will provide/produce replacement (angled) soles. This boot is SO large volume that if one is serious about having their foot held. They will have to choose a smaller last only provided by a real race version.

 

But for the medium to large volume skier with a fat for foot and wallet. This is the perfect solution. As long as they want a SOFT 130.


Soft in the shop or soft outside. I feel that the Ghost 130 is soft inside but once you get it in the cold it stiffens up quite a bit, and is a chore to get out of.

post #14 of 25

I feel that omitting moldable cuff is sort of a mistake.  Well-fitting foot section with a loose cuff won't be fun.  If you do the lowers, why not do the whole monty (err... whole Fischer) and do the whole boot.?

post #15 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexzn View Post

I feel that omitting moldable cuff is sort of a mistake.  Well-fitting foot section with a loose cuff won't be fun.  If you do the lowers, why not do the whole monty (err... whole Fischer) and do the whole boot.?


Trying to understand why you think the cuff would be loose? Aside from the Fischer Kool-Aide. My experience with Solly cuff's is that they are anything but sloppy. Though I have a pretty thick calf.

post #16 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecimmortal View Post


Trying to understand why you think the cuff would be loose? Aside from the Fischer Kool-Aide. My experience with Solly cuff's is that they are anything but sloppy. Though I have a pretty thick calf.

Bingo...  What works for you, and may not work for the other guy.  Fischer KoolAid aside, a snug cuff is pretty nifty thing.   Fischer process delivers it and it adds a lot to the feel of the boot.  There is no reason Salomon should not be able to do the same thing.  And I am not even talking about people who have  upper leg shape problem and have to resort to cutting the tops.  

post #17 of 25

This thread has been dormant for a bit, but.....might as well try it :)

 

I skied the 2013 X-Max 120 all year.  I found it very comfortable.  I also found it a bit soft-flexing.  In any event, what I noticed most was the lack of forward lean.  Now, having said that, my last 2-3 boots have all been aggressive race boots with old-school forward lean.  Frankly, I never got used to my new boots for that reason. My question:  is the X-Max lineup less aggressive with its forward stance than similar boots from other manufacturers?  I understand that all boot manufacturers are going to a more upright stance to better match the geometry of new skis. But are the X-Max's particularly up-right?   Back in the day, boot manufacturers would publish the forward lean measurements on their upper-end boots....I can't find any such stats these days.

 

Thanks for any advice!

post #18 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexzn View Post
 

Bingo...  What works for you, and may not work for the other guy.  Fischer KoolAid aside, a snug cuff is pretty nifty thing.   Fischer process delivers it and it adds a lot to the feel of the boot.  There is no reason Salomon should not be able to do the same thing.  And I am not even talking about people who have  upper leg shape problem and have to resort to cutting the tops.  

 

I bought X-Max 100 from Heino's in Pequannock NJ. They used the Fischer vacuum system to fit me. These boots were
 
soft flexing when warm and firm up outside.
post #19 of 25

 I'm using the 130's. My fellow instructor went for the 120's and wishes he went 130. As the threads state, I don't think they flex exactly true to their rating but the 130 is a dream boot for my wider foot and large calf. It is for me the best feeling and fitting boot I have EVER skied in. I can feel every piece of snow underfoot. Comfortable enough when I'm instructing, superb for free skiing and just awesome for when I am junior race coaching and have to crank them hard! 

My Recommendation? Go for it! :) 

post #20 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoenixSkier View Post
 

 I am the lead boot fitter at a ski shop in Phoenix. Don't laugh. We are the third biggest shop in America.

 

The new Salomon x-max 130. Is easy to get on. Very comfortable. Actually large volume for my foot; in the fore-foot. Salomon is trying not to (continue) getting outsold by more comfortable boots. My background includes full-time employment by Salomon and past technical testing team member.

 

 

They could fit great everywhere. As I stated in post 18, my shop used the Fischer system to mold my boots. They heated the boots in the oven. They then put bags around the boots and sucked the air out making a very tight fit. After standing in a skiing position for seven minutes ice pack were used for cooling. The boots were difficult to enter and exit. I've sprayed the linings with silicone to make it easier.

post #21 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ishaw333 View Post

This thread has been dormant for a bit, but.....might as well try it smile.gif

I skied the 2013 X-Max 120 all year.  I found it very comfortable.  I also found it a bit soft-flexing.  In any event, what I noticed most was the lack of forward lean.  Now, having said that, my last 2-3 boots have all been aggressive race boots with old-school forward lean.  Frankly, I never got used to my new boots for that reason. My question:  is the X-Max lineup less aggressive with its forward stance than similar boots from other manufacturers?  I understand that all boot manufacturers are going to a more upright stance to better match the geometry of new skis. But are the X-Max's particularly up-right?   Back in the day, boot manufacturers would publish the forward lean measurements on their upper-end boots....I can't find any such stats these days.

Thanks for any advice!
It isn't modern skiing equipment that has resulted in more upright boots, but a modern understanding that contradicts the old "common knowledge." The old idea was that if you wanted someone to be in the front seat then you should lift their heel and force them forward with forward lean. The modern standard is that if you bring the tongue of the boot to the skier then you will achieve shin pressure (a.k.a. being in the front seat).

The reality is that there are various degrees of flexibility in the ankles of each skier. If you can bend your ankle 17 degrees and your buddy can only flex 7 degrees then in a boot with 11 degrees delta (that is forward lean minus ramp angle) you are good to go but he is screwed. He won't be able to get his shin on the tongue, calf off of the spine or toes off of the front. In a boot with 7 degrees delta, you are both good to go.

Anyone can ski an upright boot, but not everyone can handle the same degree of forward angle. If you still don't get what I'm saying, do some googling about volkl's bio-logic skis, particularly about the ramp angle.
post #22 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOTech,Inc. View Post
 


If the boot was as you described, all black with a red and black Sidas Thermo liner, it was not next years Salomon X-Max. It is the Sidas Black Project boot.

 

The Black Project boots are built off of this year's X3/Falcon and Impact chassis with your choice of a Thermo or Foam Conformable liner.

They do not have the custom shell panels, so there is no cooking of the shell, just the liner. While the Salomon logo does appear on the boot it is badged as a Sidas Custom.

 

We sold the boot this year and did very well with them.

 

I find it curious that someone would be selling this boot and not know what it was or what to do with it.

 

Next year's Salomon X-Max is going to do very well, I spent much of the spring skiing in one. The shape has changed quite a bit and the foot has been moved further back in the shell, along with a variety of other changes. Less forward lean, no cuff alignment and better ingress/egress to name a few.

 

The Sidas Black boot will not change for next season and continues with the X3/Falcon last for one more season.

 

jl

are the Salomon Custom boots mouldable for the whole shell or only the forefoot part is custom-able?

post #23 of 25

The whole boot is moldable.  Obviously, the places on the boot that have the most flexibility and overlap will be those that can be molded to the highest degree (e.g. the cuff).  I don't believe the toe box, heel, etc. are impacted by the molding process at all. 

post #24 of 25

 

Dear, i mean this pair , the dealer is not sure about that?

 

THis pair is whole shell mouldable , right?

 

Thanks

post #25 of 25

No, only the CS (white) panels are moldable, I do not know if that boot has medial panels like the other early CS boots and what color they are but you should clearly see the seam around the panel. Anything else is not moldable in that boot besides the regular punching that a boot fitter can do.

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