EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › General Skiing Discussion › What level is a east coast run at Vail?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

What level is a east coast run at Vail? - Page 2

post #31 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

all right thanks guys

and if I'm for a challenge that's on the trail map prima cornice is the hardest run? and is it even that hard?



No, after you hop the rocks, it's two turns long!

post #32 of 56

Where'd you pull the stats from? How is the score calculated? And where is Tank on the mountain? Pretty familiar with the mtn and don't recall seeing it.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanvg View Post

Below is some empirical data regarding some of the steepest runs at Vail.  The stats are great because they are not bias but they also don't capture other details that can make a run harder such as run width and snow conditions.  Prima Cornice is very steep at the top but not too bad after that.  The chutes are steeper for longer and very narrow.  There are also many lines in the back bowls and blue ski that are fun. 

 

Ski Area Run length height degree Score
Vail Prima C 93 94.5 45.5 95.6
Vail Gangas Khan 1601 812 26.9 90.6
Vail Chicken Run 543 299 28.8 87.7
Vail Ratsput'n 664 472 35.4 95.0
Vail lov leap 256 171 33.7 89.5
Vail lov leap upper 268 195 36.0 92.6
Vail Windows 951 543 29.7 90.7
Vail Riva 317 164 27.4 82.1
Vail Mudslide 454 295 33.0 91.4
Vail main chute 246 169 34.5 90.2
Vail tank 198 152 37.5 92.6
Vail challenge 144 108 36.9 90.9

 



 

post #33 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

Finally are the east vail chutes harder than prima cornice? ive heard their pretty wicked

 



East Vail chutes are avalanche chutes, uncontrolled, and there have been people killed there.  Do you have a transceiver, probe, shovel and know how to use them?  Have you skied uncontrolled terrain before?

 

Not for the uninitiated, uninformed, inexperienced, and unprepared.  If, on the other hand, you know what you are doing, then you'd probably not be asking this sort of question on the internet.

 

Mike

post #34 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rushbikes View Post

And where is Tank on the mountain? Pretty familiar with the mtn and don't recall seeing it.

 



I think it might be one of the front side chutes, by Mudslide/Narrows/Pump House, but I could be wrong (someone please correct me if so). Mudslide is a fun one. 


Edited by LiveJazz - 12/6/11 at 9:26am
post #35 of 56

Correct me if I am wrong but I think this pillow line is at Vail?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3If0NpbqXk&feature=related

 

Been skiing the East Coast quite some time and the # of 12'+ mandatory air ins is limited for sure.  Only place really offering "true" expert skiing terrain is MRG and Stowe and you need to know where to go.

 

See below

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peBC7ioGwFg&feature=related

 

 

post #36 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by swellhunter View Post

Correct me if I am wrong but I think this pillow line is at Vail?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3If0NpbqXk&feature=related

 

Been skiing the East Coast quite some time and the # of 12'+ mandatory air ins is limited for sure.  Only place really offering "true" expert skiing terrain is MRG and Stowe and you need to know where to go.

 

See below

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peBC7ioGwFg&feature=related

 

 




just like the true extreme terrain of Stowe, MRG(and smuggs) does not matter to even the average expert skier that pillow line Outta of bounds at Vail has no bearing on the fact the majority of the place is mellow.

post #37 of 56

Tank aka "Spank the Tank" is usually considered one of the front side chutes.  There is a large water tank that I presume is for snowmaking.  The run entrance is near there.  Ski the lift line of Vista Bahn and you'll find it.

 

All of the metrics I posted were derived from Google Earth.  Google Earth does occasionally have some errors in it but it is generally accurate and free of bias.  The "Score" is a concept I have created which attempts to quantify a run's value based on its average pitch and vertical drop.  The steeper the better.  The longer the better.  It gets more complicated when evaluating a short steep run to a long flatter run. 

 

 

Swellhunter, Jay also has some extreme runs in the east (along with MRG and Stowe)

 

post #38 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanvg View Post

Tank aka "Spank the Tank" is usually considered one of the front side chutes.  There is a large water tank that I presume is for snowmaking.  The run entrance is near there.  Ski the lift line of Vista Bahn and you'll find it.

 

All of the metrics I posted were derived from Google Earth.  Google Earth does occasionally have some errors in it but it is generally accurate and free of bias.  The "Score" is a concept I have created which attempts to quantify a run's value based on its average pitch and vertical drop.  The steeper the better.  The longer the better.  It gets more complicated when evaluating a short steep run to a long flatter run. 

 

 

Swellhunter, Jay also has some extreme runs in the east (along with MRG and Stowe)

 




and Smuggs.

 

 

 

 

 

post #39 of 56

Hockley Valley, I'm going to make the following assumptions. You are a very good skier that skis most of his days on a pretty short adnd icy east coast "hill".Vail has more than 5,000 acres of lift serviced skiing and IMHO you can find enough challenging terrian to keep you motivated to ski as well and as hard as you can. If you ski Prima , Pronto, Log Chute back to back to back and aren't challenged or tired then I guess you really are at the wrong resort. There is definitely steep terrian to be found and when you get there in March everythng wil be oen and in good shape with coverage. They recieved 520 in of snow last year witha  yearly avrage of 344 in.

 

There is a reason there are a lot of great skiers that live in Vail. Yes there are other areas that on a percentage basis have harder terrain than Vail. But I'm pretty confident you will not get bored or be disappointed at Vail. Of the 5,000 acres much of it is skiable for intermediates and up, but you still have a lot of terrain left that will be very challengng.

 

Vail is 3400 ft. vertical mountain. There is a lot to be had. Consider the source here, I have never skied off the cornice in Blue Sky (Lovers Leap) preferring (wimping out)to go further down to Iron Mask, which is a great run IMHO. Are there harder montains in the west, sure, but Vail has great snow, great lift system, and a varied and wide selection of ski terrian that will satisfy moat skiers.

 

If you ski all the tough stuff (well) at Vail and are underwhelmed than I steered you wrong . The fact you still ski at home I believe supports the fact that you will love Vail and have a great memorable time. Have fun!

post #40 of 56

If you want real extreme/challenging terrain there isn't much inbounds at Vail, but there is a plethora of big terrain OB. As stated before it is uncontrolled, has killed people, and will kill again. Please be careful adventuring out there, and make sure you have a partner and know how to use your BC equipment.

 

But ya Vail rocks and I enjoy it.

ski.gif

 

 

Video I made last season with lots of footage from East Vail.

 

post #41 of 56
Thread Starter 

Sick vid
so doing the east vail chutes without avy gear is a deathwish?

like theres no way you should?

post #42 of 56

It's not for the unprepared or uninformed. I'm guessing by the questions, you've never taken an avalanche training course and don't own avy gear. If you did, you would know that any backcountry adventure requires the right tools and the right know-how, which isn't to say that that nullifies all risk. But the difference between going back there prepared with someone who knows the lay of the land and going back there with neither is the difference between minimizing risk and being flat out stupid. No, not everyone dies who goes back there. But several people do every year.

 

For those who do have avy gear and training, and a friend(s) to ski with who have the same, be sure to go back there with someone who knows the terrain. There are some pretty serious cliffs that you don't want to wander over, and there are a number of chutes that are seriously prone to slides.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

Sick vid
so doing the east vail chutes without avy gear is a deathwish?

like theres no way you should?


 

 

post #43 of 56

If your looking to try challenging your self Oriental express can be a fun one. It has several cliff bands with drops approaching 30 feet but the cliff bands are usually avoidable if you deicde to bail and they offer a variety of much smaller drops as well.

post #44 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

Sick vid
so doing the east vail chutes without avy gear is a deathwish?

like theres no way you should?


Avy gear is only a small piece of the equation.  Remember, a transceiver, probe and shovel are used to find and dig you out- nice to have if you are in that situation, but that means  YOU ALREADY FCUKed up.  Thinking your gear is going to protect you is a recipe for disaster.  Much better to have good experience/judgement than good gear (but those with the former have the latter in case they make a mistake).

 

When you drive past the East Vail chutes, you'll notice that most have big mounds at the bottom- that is from the build up of everything that has slid down.  Combine that with the cliffs and there is a lot that can go wrong.  

 

I think that Roundturns has it right- plenty to entertain you at Vail and if it is not challenging enough the same lift ticket usually covers Beaver Creek just down the road  which has some in bounds chutes and glades that likely will.  Or you can come over to Breck and do the stuff off the top of 7/8 and some of the double blacks off 9 and 10. 

 

post #45 of 56

I 70 is no worse then the 400 extension heading to Mount St Louis Moonstone on one of those snow squall mornings in the snow belt and very similar, going through possible heavy snow and coming back out to sun shine.  If you head over that way any time, being a Hockley Valley skier, it is definitely no worse the drive up the windy Hwy 24 to Collingwood, or Airport road on a windy day up to all points north of Caledonia.  With any luck you'll have great weather when heading to the hill and the snow will come at night with clear roads when you're driving.  I have been to Vail, CO a few times now and I have always hit portions of snow covered roads but nothing I wasn't used to driving on the 400 North extension.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

thank so much

two more questions

how bad is the I70?

and will Vail be overly crowded from the 12-16 of march?(mon-fri)



 

post #46 of 56

I've skied from North Carolina to the West to Europe and back. I think they are all close enough to give you a good guide to what you're getting into. The two big day to day variables are grooming and hard pack. A well groomed blue run might be fun one day but a week later if it's ungroomed or hard packed it could have difficult sections for many intermediates. Sometimes in the East a blue run with moderated pitch can be almost unskiable due to ice so conditions are often more important than ratings.

post #47 of 56

I would recommend if you don't have BC gear, a little training, and guidance; there is enough terrain inbounds to excite just about anybody. Dragons teeth in China bowl and a few hits in Blue Sky have steep and long runouts that you can play on cliff bands all day. Or you can ski chair 10 for long fun bumps, chair 11 for a few steeper runs, cliffs and tree skiing. Sundown and Sunup bowls for open bowl skiing. Rasputins is a really fun run with a few cliffs and probably one of the longest sustained pitch runs at Vail. The downside of Rasputins is it is south facing so it gets kind of crappy snow.

 

As I side note Prima Cornice (off chair 11) would be a lot better if they would keep it closed till mid feb. Let the snow settle in and maybe take a page from Highlands and boot pack it early season for a good base. Prima Cornice IMO is not worth the rock dodging and lack of snow. There is some sweet sidcountry that is really similar to Prima C and you can drop cliffs without hitting mach 10 and having to dodge rocks.

post #48 of 56

Quote:
Originally Posted by HuckSolo View Post

 Prima Cornice IMO is not worth the rock dodging and lack of snow. There is some sweet sidcountry that is really similar to Prima C and you can drop cliffs without hitting mach 10 and having to dodge rocks.



Are you referring to the sidecountry back in Blue Sky? On the frontside?

post #49 of 56

^ The Blue Sky sidecountry has some really fun pillow lines and well-placed drops, but it can take a little searching to find them. I can never remember exactly where everything is from season to season, as the start of the fun stuff is hidden behind a wall of thick trees, so you can't see it from the main traverse. 

post #50 of 56

yup what he ^ said!

 

biggrin.gif

post #51 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by lady_Salina View Post

I 70 is no worse then the 400 extension heading to Mount St Louis Moonstone on one of those snow squall mornings in the snow belt and very similar, going through possible heavy snow and coming back out to sun shine.  If you head over that way any time, being a Hockley Valley skier, it is definitely no worse the drive up the windy Hwy 24 to Collingwood, or Airport road on a windy day up to all points north of Caledonia.  With any luck you'll have great weather when heading to the hill and the snow will come at night with clear roads when you're driving.  I have been to Vail, CO a few times now and I have always hit portions of snow covered roads but nothing I wasn't used to driving on the 400 North extension.
 



 

Just to put this in perspective, the road to Collingwood has big flashing road closed signs that come on long before you can't make it through with a caprice and snow tires.  The problem isn't so much getting stuck; it's not seeing where you're going in a whiteout.
 

 

post #52 of 56
Thread Starter 

What are the best runs/areas for crusing at vail?

post #53 of 56

 

Nathan, where did you pull the data for gradient and trail length from? 

post #54 of 56

Re: East Vail Chutes. Ya, don't even consider it. Seriously. It doesnt sound like you have gear, training or any local G2. So just rule it out and enjoy yourself inbounds. You will have a blast. 

 

 

post #55 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockley Valley View Post

What are the best runs/areas for crusing at vail?



Right now there is a lot of cruising terrain, mainly cause of lack of snow. But for cruising I recommend anything around Mid-Vail (3&4) , Chair 2 and the Gondola. Pretty good cruisers around there. They are getting pretty icey by the afternoons right now, because of low snowfall.

 

post #56 of 56

There have been more deaths in the East Vail Chutes in the past 10 years than at all of the areas operated by CMH Heliskiing...

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Skiing Discussion
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › General Skiing Discussion › What level is a east coast run at Vail?