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Boots To Go With My Blizzard Bonafides

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 

So I got the Blizzard Bonafides in the 187 length. I know boots are the most important aspect of skiing so im looking for the best boot to compliment my skiis. I love to spend time off-paste and need a free-ride boot that will do the job. Im 6'1" and weight 175. Last between 99-101mm.

 

I was looking at the Dalbello Viper 12 I.D.'s but realized they were race boots. Im also interested in the Fischer Soma X-110. I know people say "go to your nearest fitter and see what boot fits you best" but if im going to spend 400+ on boots then im gettig the best boot out there, not the best boot I can find locally. So please help guys!

post #2 of 19

Your skis are irrelevant. The boots are your most important piece of equipment and the best ones are the ones that match your foot shape and your fit/performance preferences. A good bootfitter can help you with this but the internet cannot.

 

SJ

post #3 of 19
Thread Starter 

The internet can tell me what boots will transfer my energy to MY skis best. Then I go and see if my local dealer has them so I can see if they fit. I would think some boots have better technology for different types of skiers. Not the "hey if they fit, thats all that matters". I UNDERSTAND how they fit is paramount. I say some boots are better than others and people online can help me find the best boot to try on.

post #4 of 19

You are sadly misinformed.

 

SJ

post #5 of 19

DylannG- you are not that far from Tahoe which is where SJ and other good boot fitters are based.  When I had my boots fitted in CO, Jeff Bergeron felt there were really only a couple of boots that had any chance of working for my long, somewhat narrow foot.  Once you figure out what boots fit your foot properly, IF you have more choices than I did, THEN you could debate online which boot is "better"  

post #6 of 19

 

  $400 is not alot to spend on boots.  That is cheap really.  You could easily spend $1500.  Buying the boot is just the start: add a foot bed, custom liners, fit and alignment, it adds up fast. 

 

Of course if you can get a pair that fit 95% out of the box...well that solves alot of issues, makes your skiing more comfortable and will save you lots of cash.  Different brands fit  different.  A boot fitter will help you get the right brand for you foot, then will put you in the right model for the type of skiing you do.

 

post #7 of 19

the best boot is the boot that fits your forefoot/ankle/heel/lower leg the best.   the rest is irrelevant.  

 

you can add a rubber zeppa rather than a cork or molded plastic zeppa, and maybe even switch out the buckles from sleek buckles to ones with fancy waves and angles and viola!  your race boots are now freeride boots.  maybe glue some faux-fur on the powerstraps and stecil some letting in rasta colors, i suppose, if you want a full-blown top end "freeride" boot.  

 

also, there is a huge difference between a 99mm last boot and a 101mm last boot, from the same manufacturer, just like there is a huge difference between a 100mm last boot between manufacturers.  you simply have to try them all on.  no other way to do it. 

 

i would strongly suggest bringing your old, worn out liners and try every boot on with them as well, to give you a good idea of what the shell will fit like once the liner is packed out as opposed to a new liner that will feel totally different after a few days.  

 

 

 

post #8 of 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by SierraJim View Post

You are sadly misinformed.

 SJ


Unfortunately, some of us get that misinformation from retailers.  I am in the market for new boots and was trying them on at local ski stores.  I was asked what type of skis I have; I told them that I currently own the Volkl Bridge and that I like them.

 

The guy fitting the boots told me that I didn't want to get boots w/ a flex >110 b/c I may overpower the ski.  He further explained that b/c the Bridge has no metal, the additional boot stiffness will transfer the energy wasted, in a lower flex boot, to the ski.   I was told that if I got too stiff a boot, I might have to buy new skis as well.

 

I had never heard of that and didn't buy boots there...but that was information provided by a retailer. 

 

(Unless I'm misunderstanding what Dylannn is saying.)

 

-Smarty 

post #9 of 19



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartyiak View Post

Quote:


Unfortunately, some of us get that misinformation from retailers.  I am in the market for new boots and was trying them on at local ski stores.  I was asked what type of skis I have; I told them that I currently own the Volkl Bridge and that I like them.

 

The guy fitting the boots told me that I didn't want to get boots w/ a flex >110 b/c I may overpower the ski.  He further explained that b/c the Bridge has no metal, the additional boot stiffness will transfer the energy wasted, in a lower flex boot, to the ski.   I was told that if I got too stiff a boot, I might have to buy new skis as well.

 

I had never heard of that and didn't buy boots there...but that was information provided by a retailer. 

 

(Unless I'm misunderstanding what Dylannn is saying.)

 

-Smarty 


Well...um...errr....the kid is kind of right.  But he has an odd way of looking at it.

 

At its simplest:

 

Expert skis are different to beginner and intermdiate skis.  Expert boots are different to beginner boots and intermdiiate boots.

 

Expert skis are designed to offer maximum performance...translate tiny moves from the boots into precise adjustments and manipulations of the ski.  To transfer these tiny moves, you need precise boots.  This means stiff (laterally especially) and thin liners.

 

Intermedite skis are desinged to be more forgiving.  This means they ignore tiny moves from the boots, and offer a stable predicatlbe ride...but sacrifice performance in doing so.  This is achieved by being torsionally soft.  Hence if you had performance boots, you wouldnt get the performance because the skis would just "ignore it"...or to be more correct the skis lack of torsional rigidity would not keep up to the performance of the boot.

 

This is not to say the skis will explode...but if you are an expert skier, you need expert skis, and boots...intermediates need intermediate skis and boots...and so on.  Mix matching expert of one with intermediate of the other will result in the overall performance being lowered to the lowest of the two.  Of course this assumes you have the skill to push either one.

 

So I dont know the skis you mentioned, but if they are intermediate skis, and you are tyring to get expert boots...ya, the store guy is right in saying somthing. To get a higher flexing boot to flex, you need to ski at speed and start pulling Gs.  That is how you flex a 150 boot.  Its is not just your wieight, it your weight mulitplied due to Gs.  If the skis cant pull Gs because they are torsionally too soft...then you wont be able to flex the boot...and...well that isnt good. So it seems he was simply saying to you...hey, you got a mis-match here.  Either you skis dont match your skill level or your boots dont. 

 

Hence buy boots that fit.  Then ensure they match your skill (manufacturers make a line of boots, so there is a variety of skill levels offered for a given last).  Buy skis that match your skill level and the type of skiing you do do...not what you see your heroes in the ski movies do.  If you follow that, you dont need to match skis to boots, or boots to skis. Match boots to your foot, and skill....skis to your skill and type of skiing.

 

 

 

post #10 of 19

double post


Edited by Skidude72 - 11/14/11 at 11:48pm
post #11 of 19



 

triple postconfused.gif


Edited by Skidude72 - 11/14/11 at 11:49pm
post #12 of 19



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartyiak View Post

Quote:


Unfortunately, some of us get that misinformation from retailers.  I am in the market for new boots and was trying them on at local ski stores.  I was asked what type of skis I have; I told them that I currently own the Volkl Bridge and that I like them.

 

The guy fitting the boots told me that I didn't want to get boots w/ a flex >110 b/c I may overpower the ski.  He further explained that b/c the Bridge has no metal, the additional boot stiffness will transfer the energy wasted, in a lower flex boot, to the ski.   I was told that if I got too stiff a boot, I might have to buy new skis as well.

 

I had never heard of that and didn't buy boots there...but that was information provided by a retailer. 

 

(Unless I'm misunderstanding what Dylannn is saying.)

 

-Smarty 


Well...um...errr....the kid is kind of right.  But he has an odd way of looking at it.

 

At its simplest:

 

Expert skis are different to beginner and intermdiate skis.  Expert boots are different to beginner boots and intermdiiate boots.

 

Expert skis are designed to offer maximum performance...translate tiny moves from the boots into precise adjustments and manipulations of the ski.  To transfer these tiny moves, you need precise boots.  This means stiff (laterally especially) and thin liners.

 

Intermedite skis are desinged to be more forgiving.  This means they ignore tiny moves from the boots, and offer a stable predicatlbe ride...but sacrifice performance in doing so.  This is achieved by being torsionally soft.  Hence if you had performance boots, you wouldnt get the performance because the skis would just "ignore it"...or to be more correct the skis lack of torsional rigidity would not keep up to the performance of the boot.

 

This is not to say the skis will explode...but if you are an expert skier, you need expert skis, and boots...intermediates need intermediate skis and boots...and so on.  Mix matching expert of one with intermediate of the other will result in the overall performance being lowered to the lowest of the two.  Of course this assumes you have the skill to push either one.

 

So I dont know the skis you mentioned, but if they are intermediate skis, and you are tyring to get expert boots...ya, the store guy is right in saying somthing. To get a higher flexing boot to flex, you need to ski at speed and start pulling Gs.  That is how you flex a 150 boot.  Its is not just your wieight, it your weight mulitplied due to Gs.  If the skis cant pull Gs because they are torsionally too soft...then you wont be able to flex the boot...and...well that isnt good. So it seems he was simply saying to you...hey, you got a mis-match here.  Either you skis dont match your skill level or your boots dont. 

 

Hence buy boots that fit.  Then ensure they match your skill (manufacturers make a line of boots, so there is a variety of skill levels offered for a given last).  Buy skis that match your skill level and the type of skiing you do do...not what you see your heroes in the ski movies do.  If you follow that, you dont need to match skis to boots, or boots to skis. Match boots to your foot, and skill....skis to your skill and type of skiing.

 

 

 

post #13 of 19

So all experts ski with a very stiff boot, intermediates with a softer flexing boot and beginners with very soft boots?  And if you're going to use expert skis you have to wear stiff boots?  What if the skier cannot flex this so-called expert boot?  It is just a waste of money to buy a 130 flex boot when all you can flex is a 100.  Someone who weighs 140 pounds will have a much more difficult time flexing a 130 boot than someone who weighs 180 pounds.  Go to a competent fitter and get the boot that fits your feet the best AND that you can flex.  If you cannot flex a boot in a warm store, you'll certainly never flex it out on the snow.

post #14 of 19

stiffness of boot is related to:

 

1. skiers ankle flexion

2. ability of the skier to generate the leverage and power to bend the boot

3. amount of skier weight balanced @ BOF vs. heel

4. weight and height of skier 

 

 

 

post #15 of 19

The only time researching which boot is "better" comes into play is if you find two boots that fit you equally well.  And chances are it won't matter as long as you have a good fit.

 

Given how expensive skiing is in general and how much the average skier drops on skis, gas, lift tickets, apparel, etc. I'm amazed how often people worry about the price of ski boots.  If you're going to spend hundreds or even thousands of hours in these boots, what's a few hundred dollars more or less for a proper fit?

post #16 of 19

double post


Edited by Skidude72 - 11/14/11 at 11:48pm
post #17 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtcyclist View Post

So all experts ski with a very stiff boot, intermediates with a softer flexing boot and beginners with very soft boots?  And if you're going to use expert skis you have to wear stiff boots?  What if the skier cannot flex this so-called expert boot?  It is just a waste of money to buy a 130 flex boot when all you can flex is a 100.  Someone who weighs 140 pounds will have a much more difficult time flexing a 130 boot than someone who weighs 180 pounds.  Go to a competent fitter and get the boot that fits your feet the best AND that you can flex.  If you cannot flex a boot in a warm store, you'll certainly never flex it out on the snow.


Well, kinda but you are missing a few things.

 

Forward flex is one factor in "expert" boots, but a more important one is lateral stiffness and responsivness.  So you might get a skier that prefers a softer flexing boot for one reason or another, but they cant just get into an intermediate boot because they will also lose the lateral stiffness/responsiveness.  Thus you need to get expert boots, and cut them to soften them.

 

Also while weight matters, it only matters in the sense of all other things being equal.  G-force generated by the turn is a substantial factor.  WC skiers pull 3g in GS.  With all your weight on one ski a 200lb skier can put 600lbs of force on 1 boot.  Or using your example a 140lb skier, at even say 2G can put 280lbs on one boot. There is no way to get that in a store.  A lower skill 180lber who cant generate much over 1g, and skis two footed, might be limited to only 90lbs of force.....hence intermediate boots are softer to allow the skier to get the same range of motion.
 

 

post #18 of 19

Yes... I'll second the statement that you're misinformed. There are several manufactures that all make great boots. Without seeing or having a good description of your feet, I don't think anyone could in good faith begin to tell you what boots to consider. 

 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DylannnG View Post

The internet can tell me what boots will transfer my energy to MY skis best. Then I go and see if my local dealer has them so I can see if they fit. I would think some boots have better technology for different types of skiers. Not the "hey if they fit, thats all that matters". I UNDERSTAND how they fit is paramount. I say some boots are better than others and people online can help me find the best boot to try on.



 

post #19 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by msolson View Post

stiffness of boot is related to:

 

1. skiers ankle flexion

2. ability of the skier to generate the leverage and power to bend the boot

3. amount of skier weight balanced @ BOF vs. heel

4. weight and height of skier 

 

 

 


Would like to foreground the first three points here, cuz we tend to dwell on the last. My PT has been educating me about ankle flexion. A big deal, actually, in controlling your skis. #2 can be skier speed, but also skier leg strength (re: Dawg). #3 is a big deal when you consider that some boots "assume" a particular stance. Finally, I'd add that skiing style (tip pressure vs. lateral tipping) should influence which boot you buy. But all boot companies make excellent boots that'll do the job. It's about nuances, personal preferences, often picking a particular model and modifying it, rather than worrying about brands. (Which are more about last shape and volume assumptions.)

 

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