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Skiing with glasses - Page 2

post #31 of 56

@mgrezmer - You've really hit it on the head.  OTG goggles are always a compromise.  Inserts are truly the only way to go IMHO if a spectacle lens is required for any reason over contacts. &(@Hawaii50) - I think those OSBE helmets look sick...but that could be because we've got F-22's, F-16's and A-10's flying out of two air bases nearby.  :)  Sorry the wife didn't concur!

 

@SnoWonder - Change doctors/opticians.  If your contacts truly "blew off of your corneas", you've had the absolute w-o-r-s-t fit I've ever heard of in my entire career.  Either that, or you ski at speeds approaching re-entry and you should make sure your outer layer is made of space shuttle tiles so you don't burn up!  :)  Seriously, that is nothing but a horrible cl fit, and should never have been let go from the doctor's exam lane like that.  Try again - but try a doc/optician who actually knows what they're doing.  Since it was more than 20 years ago, it's time you tried it with a modern fit using modern CL design and materials.  You'll probably LOVE them.  Watch the face plants though!  :)

 

@hobbes - If contacts don't work out, the Smith insert would be the first place I'd direct my own patients.  With that said - ask your doc about 2 or 4 week lenses.  They are for all intents and purposes the same thing as the dailies but at a tiny fraction of the cost.  Just be responsible enough to clean them.  Sadly many adults still don't have a grasp on basic hygiene, never clean or change their lenses and then come crying (literally) back to us with raging infections.  Don't do that.  It's bad.  Your cornea's will hate you.  But basic CL care is a cakewalk compared to the prep and upkeep required with even modest ski gear.  You'll do fine.

 

@ Toecutter - As long as you've got air movement, you should have minimal/no fogging problems.  Just remember never to clean the inner surface of any goggle lens while it's wet or damp.  That will both destroy your optics, and kill any hope of anti-fog properties.  The aftermarket solutions/creams are for the most part nothing but smoke and mirrors.  Save your money and invest in a better quality goggle.  (IMHO Oakley is NOT it.)

 

@Buster - Your helmet epiphany is a good point.  We actually suggest a quality goggle/helmet combination for our patients if they aren't already wearing.  Fogging is caused by warm(er) moisture condensing on a cool(er) surface.  But with even slight air moving across that surface, it can in many cases, be easily mitigated.  The newer helmet designs help a great deal with venting - and anything that reduces/eliminates gapper is a plus right?  :)  You may like one of the active fan goggles to help move just a little more air when your motion decreases.  It could well make the small bit of difference you'd need to stay 100% fog free all the time.

 

Cheers

 

Bri~

 

 

post #32 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post

 

@ Toecutter - As long as you've got air movement, you should have minimal/no fogging problems.  Just remember never to clean the inner surface of any goggle lens while it's wet or damp.  That will both destroy your optics, and kill any hope of anti-fog properties.  The aftermarket solutions/creams are for the most part nothing but smoke and mirrors.  Save your money and invest in a better quality goggle.  (IMHO Oakley is NOT it.)

 


I think you misunderstand -- I've never had a fogging problem on the goggle lens.  I have a fogging problem on the eyeglass lenses.  Cat Crap has been the only thing keeping things at bay.  Oakley is the only goggle manufacturer that makes an Asian Fit (unless you can point me to another manufacturer that does).  I've found no other goggle manufacturer who makes a frame that seals up against my face without an air gap at my nose bridge, which means that Oakley Asian Fit is the only one that keeps snow out from inside my goggles.  Despite any issues Oakley might have with lens optics, if my glasses fog up the goggle optics don't make any difference.  Even the Smith turbo fan didn't help since powder snow would blow up the front of my face and end up packing up inside my goggles.

 

post #33 of 56

I've had pretty good luck since 2008 with Scott Storm OTG goggles when I am feeling to lazy to mess with my contacts.  On cold days I put them on before I leave the lodge and don't touch them again until I come back in and I rarely have a problem.  

post #34 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toecutter View Post


I think you misunderstand -- I've never had a fogging problem on the goggle lens.  I have a fogging problem on the eyeglass lenses.  Cat Crap has been the only thing keeping things at bay.  Oakley is the only goggle manufacturer that makes an Asian Fit (unless you can point me to another manufacturer that does).  I've found no other goggle manufacturer who makes a frame that seals up against my face without an air gap at my nose bridge, which means that Oakley Asian Fit is the only one that keeps snow out from inside my goggles.  Despite any issues Oakley might have with lens optics, if my glasses fog up the goggle optics don't make any difference.  Even the Smith turbo fan didn't help since powder snow would blow up the front of my face and end up packing up inside my goggles.

 



Oops!  I likely did misinterpret what you were saying.  I've seen and heard about fogging on both the goggle lens and also insert lenses either one.  I've got a new lens available in our practice now called OptiFog which looks to be the answer to fogged insert-wearing skiers prayers.  It's got a treatment that can be applied as often as needed and it works in tandem with an imbedded surface treatment.  The lens is designed to outperform any current anti-fog aftermarket treatment.  Believe me, I'm a big believer in Cat Crap.  I actually know Ed (from EK Products) he's one crazy mofo...but he KNOWS his stuff when it comes to extreme outdoor sports.  OptiFog is every bit as effective, and I believe it may well outperform it over a much wider range of conditions.  You may want to ask your local optician if they can get it yet?

 

As for the Oakley frame issue - if they're the only one's that fit the way you need them to - then wear them - optics be damned.  I'm not aware of any other makers that market an "Asian fit" the way the big O does.  That's not to say there may not be a plethora of other makers/models that wouldn't fit the bill...just that they aren't paying millions to put their glossy ads in front of your nose.  :)

 

Cheers

 

B~

post #35 of 56



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post

 

Concerning glasses and goggles, here's the short answer:  They almost never work.  At least they almost never work well, or even fair.   

 

 

Hello all, been lurking for awhile now but Uillean’s comment opened the door to making my first post.  Uillean – couldn’t agree more with all that you have contributed in this thread.  Just wish I or Elsker or any of the others contributing to this thread had started it a couple of years earlier as it would have saved me all the experimenting and hassles with OTG goggles (in particular trying to make the Smith Turbo Fans work).  My glasses would inevitably fog when I needed them most (i.e. blizzard conditions) despite using all the tricks mentioned in this thread.  And of course after one face plant in the powder you were done. 

 

Last season I finally tried single use contacts; (Focus Dailies Toric) for those days that I knew I would need goggles.  (I wear prescription sunglasses while skiing when weather permits).  What a blessing not having to deal with fogging no matter how bad the weather – AND what a pain in the arse getting the contacts in (though gets easier with practice) but especially getting them out after a day of skiing.  There were times when I thought I would have to take myself to emergency to get them peeled off my eyes.  Obviously an issue with contacts/eyes drying out even under goggles.  Have tried all the Ophthalmologist recommended eye drops – none of which are much help.  (My son who surfs a lot and wears contacts full time – and loses them periodically while surfing – wanted to switch to this same brand since they seem to stay in so well (an understatement).  His Dr. told him they wouldn’t help him and that his father (me) just had “old man eyes” that caused the contacts to dry out and stick.)  I’m thinking there must be other “more mature” skiers wearing contacts that have solved the dry eye problem.  Any suggestions?  Anyone?

 

And one other issue pertaining to OTG goggles that I haven’t seen mentioned so far in this thread is the helmet compatibility problem.  OTG goggles generally are a bit larger than other goggles and for me were pushed onto the bridge of my nose by my helmet.  Tried on many different helmets till finally going with a Smith Variant.  Interestingly even it wasn’t truly compatible with the Smith Turbo Fan goggles (on my face) without modifying the helmet padding to slightly raise the front of the helmet a bit on my head.  Bottom line, shop with helmet in hand when buying OTG goggles.

 

post #36 of 56

My contacts absolutey work the best when i am skiing. They are flawless. I wear 30 day (can't sleep in them) Torics.

 

Vision is great  and I don't know I am even wearing them.

 

I only wear contacts when i ski. Glasses the remainder of the time. Occasionally when I play tennis (only if outdoors and it is really sunny)

 

If your contacts are not staying in your eye maybe you need to try different brands and types.

 

Lenses have different water content and the more water content they have the drier they get  with wind.

 

I also have numerous pairs of 7eye (previously Panoptx) sunglasses. Seldomly ski in them.

 

I have 3 pair non-prescription and 2 pair prescription. One is Copper NXT Photochromatic that only fixes my long distance vision

and then a pair of Photochromatic Day & night that are progressive bi-focals (Also use them with the full air dam when riding my motorcycle, where the are fantastic). Also lets me sit by at the beach or by a pool and read and then go right inside to a restaurant or such and read the menu and they go damn near clear and are very dark wqwhen in ultra violet land!

 

Problem with the 7eye with the full  airdams when skiing is they somewhat limit periperal vision and depending on your prescription,  you could be  limited to models that have less curvature to the lenses.

 

 

 


Edited by Atomicman - 11/10/11 at 8:14am
post #37 of 56

jdleuk hits it square.  From a dispensers standpoint, we're blessed with a greater array of makers, styles, materials and options than ever before in goggles (and helmets too).  And amazingly, they STILL have yet to create a truly revolutionary Rx/insert capable goggle that handles excellent visual requirements, fogging, fit and durability equally well.  In almost every case, it's not even a choice of "pick any three"...you're lucky to get two from that list.

 

With that said, contact lenses can be the blessing many of us are in need of - assuming we can get a good fit.  And therein lies the rub.  It shouldn't be hard, but it seems, particularly listening to many of the needs of our fellow Epic members here, that well-fit contacts elude more than a few.  Without sitting down directly with everyone one on one in an exam lane, it is of course impossible to diagnose or recommend a course of action related to contacts (not to mention illegal).  However, I might make a few humble suggestions in a general sense that I hope may offer some greater options for clear comfortable vision on the mountain.

 

First of all, if you're going for your fitting with an ophthalmologist (specialized eye surgeon, MD), you might be spinning your wheels.  There are times that the MD needs to step in, and generally you'll know it when it happens (parts falling off your eyeball would be a great example)  :D  But in a general sense, experience tells me that you will be stacking the deck in your favor for a great fit having your routine examination done with an optometrist (specialized general eye doctor, OD).  As a rule, you'll probably to have far more actual chair time with the optometrist, and are likely to have a more thorough fitting experience.  With an MD, most (sometimes all) of the fit is done by a technician who may or may not be well trained in what they need to know to excel at complex sports fits.

 

Please bear in mind - these are broad and general impressions, based on my own direct experience (20+ years now) from the doctor/dispenser side of the table.  I was also "that guy" for a lot of years as well - the ophthalmologists "contact lens guy".  I knew what I was doing for the most part, but the complex fits were never easy.  A good OD would have, and frankly to this day still could fit circles around me, as it should be.

 

Contacts and skiing really can work extremely well for a large segment of the population, but it requires an exceptional doc, and reasonable expectations and motivation from the wearer to achieve perceived perfection.  :)  Again, I will never offer medical advice here, but should any of you find yourselves in Salt Lake, feel free to stop in.  I'd love a chance to meet you and say hi, and would be happy to discuss any questions you might have about glasses/goggles/inserts/sunglasses/LASIK/whatever.

 

And our front door is minutes away from Snowbird/Alta/Brighton/Solitude/The Canyons/Park City/Deer Valley.  Just sayin!  :)

 

PM me if you'd like contact info, as I don't want to use Epic as any sort of a real or perceived advertisement or self-promotion.  I genuinely hope I can be of help to any and all who need it.

 

Cheers!

 

Brian~

post #38 of 56

You could just get prescription goggles. No contacts, inserts or glasses!

post #39 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince F View Post

You could just get prescription goggles. No contacts, inserts or glasses!



Problem is that all front side Rx goggles (those that attempt to engineer a high base curve Rx lens into a carrier primary surface) are fraught with problems, design inadequacies and highly compromised visual qualities/fiends of view.  From a strict quality of vision scenario, all else being equal, LASIK or si-hy contacts have the highest ratios of success.  Next in line are insert goggles, but buyer beware they are not all created equal, and they require an optician well versed in both wrap design and the skiing environment to compound a truly awesome Rx lens solution.  Remember, as with the goggles themselves, not all opticians are created equal.  Some of us go to extraordinary lengths to stay on top of the latest in lens tech and capabilities, while others may have years of "experience" punctuated by doing the same thing wrong year after year.

 

Sadly, finding a truly experienced and capable optician who has the skill set needed to both design the proper Rx lenses, and fit them flawlessly to the best gog frame isn't easy or straightforward.  If you can get a local recommendation from other Rx skiers in your immediate area, word of mouth can speak volumes.  If you can't for any reason, ask about the credentials of the dispenser.  At the least, national certification is a basis for minimal competency (ABOC is the governing body of opticians in the US).  If you can, ask to see examples of previous jobs they've completed.  And remember, not all goggles/helmets fit all faces/noggins.  It's always preferred to be fit with both for the highest accuracy.  We measure in small fractions of millimeters when we fit - particularly for any wrap and digitally customized lens fits.  The better the fit and form of gog/helmet, the better our measurements can be, and the sharper your vision.

 

Never, and I mean ever purchase insert lenses without anti-glare properties.  The best also have anti-fog options available as well.  Remember that every time a light ray traverses one medium into another, you'll loose some of it's strength and coherency.  Anti-glare lenses will help to mitigate almost 100% of that in the case of inserts.  Also, bear in mind that different lens mono and polymers can behave very differently depending on both Rx, and frame dimensions.  Just because your locker-mate got one lens option does not always mean it will work for you with the same result.

 

Ask tons of questions.  The best service your optician can provide is sharing his/her knowledge to make you a much more informed client.  If you haven't been presented with enough knowledge to feel 100% confident in your purchase, either ask more questions, or find a new dispensary.

 

Just one old optician/skier's 2 pence.  Remember, YMMV, but my hope is that this gives some here a good foot to start on.

 

Cheers

 

B~

post #40 of 56

OTGs cut down peripheral vision a lot.

The Smith I/O is arguably the best goggle made. Smith does not make an Rx insert for this model, but these people do:

http://www.ski-prescription.com/product.php?code=Smith4&catid=2

They will sell you a complete package of goggle and insert with Rx lens, or just the insert with Rx lens. I just got mine but have not skied with them yet. The insert fits the I/O very well, curves with the lens shape, and looks like it will not fall out by accident. Be sure to get the permanent fog-free - very expensive but worth it.

post #41 of 56

Not sure how new these are.  Has anybody tried these.http://s4optics.com/s4_store/goggles/goggle-rx-insert.html

 

I just received a pair.  Fit well in 2 out of 3 of my goggles.  Just looking for feedback before I have the lenses made.

post #42 of 56
Rx eyewear online?

Scaaaaaaaaaary!

But perhaps this appeals to the crowd who do all their custom personalized boot fitting online as well.
Except for the fact that properly made Rx eyewear is even more complex than a boot fit of course. Nevermind the fact that none of these aftermarket, third party vendors work with the goggle companies or their frame / lens designers.

Good luck. You are going to need it.
post #43 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post

Rx eyewear online?
Scaaaaaaaaaary!
But perhaps this appeals to the crowd who do all their custom personalized boot fitting online as well.
Except for the fact that properly made Rx eyewear is even more complex than a boot fit of course. Nevermind the fact that none of these aftermarket, third party vendors work with the goggle companies or their frame / lens designers.
Good luck. You are going to need it.



No, really.  Tell me how you feel.

 

post #44 of 56

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RatherPlayThanWork View Post

Not sure how new these are.  Has anybody tried these.http://s4optics.com/s4_store/goggles/goggle-rx-insert.html

 

I just received a pair.  Fit well in 2 out of 3 of my goggles.  Just looking for feedback before I have the lenses made.


 

Uvex's RX adapters use the same design. Seems to work for them.

post #45 of 56


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post

Rx eyewear online?
Scaaaaaaaaaary!
But perhaps this appeals to the crowd who do all their custom personalized boot fitting online as well.
Except for the fact that properly made Rx eyewear is even more complex than a boot fit of course. Nevermind the fact that none of these aftermarket, third party vendors work with the goggle companies or their frame / lens designers.
Good luck. You are going to need it.

Unfortunately, expert in-person Rx eyewear fitting is as rare as expert bootfitting.  Most people get their glasses from the equivalent of a big-box sporting goods store (i.e. the chain eyeglass stores in the mall).  After a disastrous pair of bifocals I went on-line and got a much better experience, I'm sorry to say.

 

The universal problem - how do you find an expert, and how do you know when you've found them?
 

 

post #46 of 56

If you're wearing glasses it's a two word answer - Turbo Fan

post #47 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by cstreu1026 View Post

I've had pretty good luck since 2008 with Scott Storm OTG goggles when I am feeling to lazy to mess with my contacts.  On cold days I put them on before I leave the lodge and don't touch them again until I come back in and I rarely have a problem.  


+1 on this. I tried contacts precisely because not using them creates so many eyewear hurdles in my biking and skiing life, but I could not make it work despite some persistence. Big disappointment. I just could never get clear enough distance vision with them. Everything was always blurrier than with my glasses, and I couldn't get over that. Anyway, I'm still skiing with specs, and have found (independently) over the years that cstreu1026's advice is spot on. The only time I have serious trouble is on really humid / foggy / rainy days. To reiterate (and echo what a third Bear posted earlier in the thread), it's critical to put the goggles on before you leave the lodge, and don't take them off again for any reason until you're back inside the lodge. Once your glasses get cold, putting goggles on over them is guaranteed to make them fog up instantly.

 

The Storm has drawbacks - the lenses are made of some thing so soft they scratch if you are merely in the same room with anything other than talcum powder and bunny slippers - but it is the only OTG I've tried that not only fits comfortably over my glasses and under three different helmets (of different brands) over the years, but also has relatively decent above / below vision. You can also get quite a range of lens tints, including clear, which is not available for most models.

 

post #48 of 56

I ski in glasses all the time. The only time I use goggles is when it's snowing hard. 

 

I do use a pair of prescription safety glasses with auto darkening lenses. They came from Sam's. 

post #49 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdf View Post
Unfortunately, expert in-person Rx eyewear fitting is as rare as expert bootfitting.  

The universal problem - how do you find an expert, and how do you know when you've found them?

 

 

mdf,

This too has been my experience.  After I did extensive research, still the bootfitter I found was not the person to do the job.  Three times, three bootfitters, three very respected and recommended guys did me wrong and disappointed me.  I did my research, to no avail.  Finally found the right guy.  

However, I've not had that disappointment with glasses.  Food for thought?

post #50 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toecutter View Post


I think you misunderstand -- I've never had a fogging problem on the goggle lens.  I have a fogging problem on the eyeglass lenses.  Cat Crap has been the only thing keeping things at bay.  Oakley is the only goggle manufacturer that makes an Asian Fit (unless you can point me to another manufacturer that does).  I've found no other goggle manufacturer who makes a frame that seals up against my face without an air gap at my nose bridge, which means that Oakley Asian Fit is the only one that keeps snow out from inside my goggles.  Despite any issues Oakley might have with lens optics, if my glasses fog up the goggle optics don't make any difference.  Even the Smith turbo fan didn't help since powder snow would blow up the front of my face and end up packing up inside my goggles.

 



 



Quote:
Originally Posted by Uilleann View Post



Oops!  I likely did misinterpret what you were saying.  I've seen and heard about fogging on both the goggle lens and also insert lenses either one.  I've got a new lens available in our practice now called OptiFog which looks to be the answer to fogged insert-wearing skiers prayers.  It's got a treatment that can be applied as often as needed and it works in tandem with an imbedded surface treatment.  The lens is designed to outperform any current anti-fog aftermarket treatment.  Believe me, I'm a big believer in Cat Crap.  I actually know Ed (from EK Products) he's one crazy mofo...but he KNOWS his stuff when it comes to extreme outdoor sports.  OptiFog is every bit as effective, and I believe it may well outperform it over a much wider range of conditions.  You may want to ask your local optician if they can get it yet?

 

As for the Oakley frame issue - if they're the only one's that fit the way you need them to - then wear them - optics be damned.  I'm not aware of any other makers that market an "Asian fit" the way the big O does.  That's not to say there may not be a plethora of other makers/models that wouldn't fit the bill...just that they aren't paying millions to put their glossy ads in front of your nose.  :)

 

Cheers

 

B~



Agree with Uilleann regarding driving in a tunnel with the Oakley. Have a pair of Oakley crowbar asian fit - worn it once. Have to switch it out at lunch. Have not been happy with the so call Oakley quality (or lack of)  in several different products (not just goggles). More flash (cool factor) than substance. 

 

Toecutter - for good asian fit goggles, try the Smith I/Os and/or the older Phenom series. The I/O are for bigger faces with a higher nose bridge section. The Smith Transit series will also fit a smaller asian female face well.      

 

For those lusting after the OSBE helmet - the OSBE helmets are perfect for dryer blue bird day. Bought one for my son. He will only wear it for days that are not windy and/or snowing. The lens at the bottom does not seal tight against the face as a pair of goggle - leakage issues. Otherwise he loves the look & feel of it.    

 

post #51 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGrump View Post

Toecutter - for good asian fit goggles, try the Smith I/Os and/or the older Phenom series. The I/O are for bigger faces with a higher nose bridge section. The Smith Transit series will also fit a smaller asian female face well.      


Cool, thanks.  I'll check it out.

post #52 of 56

I bought a pair of frameless glasses which fit perfectly under my UVEX OTG goggles.  The problem is that even with that set up, peripheral vision was compromised.  Last season I just skied with my Oakley prescription sunglasses when I could.  On groomers that is fine but anything tough with bumps, I would go back to the glasses/goggles set up.  I have a pair of Smith OTGs as well but much prefer the UVEX.  I saw one of the Maher brothers wearing the UVEX OTGs a couple of years ago and I figured if they were good enough for him, they were good enough for me. 

post #53 of 56

OP

Oh you can do it. But it isn't easy skiing without ski poles.............Oh Eyeglasses!......I thought...........Never mind!

post #54 of 56

SportRx has a few options in terms of prescription goggles. This video is super helpful explaining the differences and advantages between the different ways you can go about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTQhH-rbDBI I think the inserts are the best way to go, personally! 

post #55 of 56

Lot of good info in here!

 

I am very very near sighted, with both of my eyes being worse than -10.  Living in a dry climate at altitude, wearing contacts day in and day out really bothers my eyes, but I do see much better with contacts than glasses.  I wear them abotu 50/50, depending on what I am up to.  Glasses are best for hanging out around the house and reading.

 

For skiing, I vastly prefer wearing my contacts.  I see better, especially peripherally, there is less chance of fogging, and I don't have to worry about possibly breaking a $500 pair of glasses.  And yes, that's what prescription glasses such as mine can cost, even with insurance.  You have to buy the very expensive plastics with all the best anti-glare stuff or you can't hardly see out of them anyways.  Even a slight bend in the frames that gets the lenses slightly off-center can cause me to see double and give me headaches until I get them refitted, so being "active" with glasses is tough.

 

That said, I have on occasion worn my glasses up to the ski mountain by accident.  Just a matter of leaving the house too early before I realize I am still wearing my glasses.  On those occasions, I try to ski with no goggles, just my glasses if it is not too sunny or cold.  I try to take it a little bit easy so I don't fall and ruin them.  If it is cold and/or sunny, I will wear my smith i/o x goggles over them.  They aren't an official OTG line, but I find that it actually works fairly well. My frames just barely fit.  Also, because they aren't exactly designed for it, the earpieces wedge open the sides of the goggles just a little bit and keep the ventiliation going at a higher then normal clip, which helps keeps the fogging on my glasses down.  Again, I try to take it easy because a fall could really screw my vision and I might need to get a ski patrol ride down the mountain and bum a car ride home if anything happened.

 

I've never tried the Smith prescription inserts, or prescription goggles in general, and I probably never will unless I somehow come into it for free.  Considering the mixed success I've had at getting good fitting glasses which I can also see out of at professional optometrist's offices, I would never assume that something like that would work at all, except for people that only need mild corrections.

post #56 of 56

Update since I last posted in 2011: Oakley Flight Deck Asian fit gives me great fit and peripheral vision. The Prizm lens is terrific too.

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