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Advice on "next" ski to get

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 

Hi All

 

Two years I go I skied on Nordica Hot Rod Overdrives and loved them - my confidence increased and I skied faster than Id ever skied before. I did feel their limts, however, on crud and at higher speeds and I'm now looking to upgrade to something that will take me to next level.

 

I'm 40 years old, 5 foot 6 and weigh 140 pounds so I'm not the biggest bloke around. Although physically fit, I'm not endowed with much physical strength so skis that are too stiff are out. I loved the Overdrives because they turned so easily and gave good edge grip and skiing on them was fun and made me feel like an expert and I suppose I'm looking for skis to help me progress even more. My favourite runs are the red runs of the Three Valleys.

 

I'm not brand Loyal but will be happy with another pair of Nordicas. I'm also lookign at Rosi Zeniths (Avengers)

 

Any advice ?

 

post #2 of 18

What type of terrain do you ski?  Are you looking to go a bit fatter?

post #3 of 18

Well, damn.  I am a heavier dood at 200lbs that likes a stiffer ski, so my recommendations are useless to you.  In general, you likely want to shop for skis with no metal (Titanial??) in them as they will be stiffer than just a fiber glass ski. No carbon fiber either.  A few years ago the board recommended some Nordica Nitrous to me.  It was a softer ski that was very user friendly and I really enjoyed them in bumps and in the steeps where tight turns were needed to check my speed.  My buddy is a light weight like you and he really likes K2 skis (Seths, ObSeth's) as he feels the brand is softer and very easy for him to ski at 6'2" 160lbs. If you can demo them, Movement makes a number of skis I think you would love. The Jam and the Source are winners for what you want IMO.  I hope this info helps you in your search.

post #4 of 18
Thread Starter 

Hi mate

 

I mainly stick to the red groomers but like the odd funpark and a little bit of of piste.  I really liked the Overdrives but felt them a bit unstable when going at high speed over some crud. Edge grip was great and they were fun, but I kept getting that "I wish they could do more" feeling hence my desire for something fun that will also take my skiing to higher levels.

 

I also want to learn to do moguls properly. I tried to nail "Leo Lecroix", a black mogul run in Les menuirs. I got down ok but zero style. My overdrives were 170's maybe try 160's or 165's

 

 

post #5 of 18

It's been awhile since I've been looking for skis like that, so I'm not sure I can be of much help.  That being said, I really enjoyed the stability and dampness of the old Head IM78 and the Nordica Top Fuel.  The Nordica was a beast and a ton of fun, though it was a demanding ski. 

 

Keep doin some research on this site.  There is a lot of good information here and some really knowledgeable people. 

post #6 of 18
Thread Starter 

Yeah

 

I keep looking and a number of skis keep cating my eye :

 

2011 Nordica  Hot Rod Igniter Ti XBC CT

2009 Noridca Hot Rod Eliminators

2009 Rossignol Zenith (Avenger) 9.5

2011 Rossignol Z76

 

 

Any advice ?

 

 

post #7 of 18

You might look into the Kastle LX82.  Kastle's skis are unisex, but this model is being marketed to women in terms of being 'light' while retaining excellent stability in crud along with very good hard snow performance and a large sweet spot.  It is still a wood/metal ski in a cap construction with (presumably) Kastle quality and characteristics.  So maybe you can get what you are looking for while retaining wood/metal sandwich construction for a better high end?

 

I am 6'2"/170 lbs and will be skiing the LX82 in a 172 cm next season.  My wife is 5'8" and 145 lbs and will be skiing it in a 164cm - she saw mine and it brought back memories of her Kastle skis from growing up in Germany so it was either she stole them from me or I got her a pair, too (hers a 9 out of 10 rated lighted used demo from Powder7.com at a great price).  I haven't skied the LX82, but it does seem worth a look for you if what is being said about this ski is accurate.

 

I'm probably a lot like you in wanting more speed/performance in crud on blues (reds) without giving up groomed performance, plus wanting to get better in the moguls, with some off piste but not needing a powder ski.  Hence I didn't stay narrower in a mid-70mm waist width, but didn't go rushing up to 98mm either.

 

Here's a review from Philpug, some other good inputs can be found by search as well.

 

http://www.epicski.com/products/2012-kastle-lx-82-ski/reviews

 

 

post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 

Hi folks

 

I finaly got myself a pair of Atomic Nomad Colts.  I'd overlooked Atomic, to be honest, but saw them in a shop (rather that online) and they felt really solid, well built and were the perfect width I'm looking for.  I got a cracking deal on them as well so bought them and can't wait to try them. They feel a lot stiffer and heavier than my old Overdrives, even without the Ti in them (like the blackeyes) but they seem good quality solid skis. It just goes to show that sometimes its better to go and view skis in a shop rather than look online all the time !

 

Anybody any experience of these ? If not,I'll review them after my trip in April !

 

 

post #9 of 18
no actual experience, but I even though you said they seemed stiff, The colts are positioned as the beginner ski in the lineup. I think you may find it hard to find anyone here who has tried it. So I would suspect it would be very flexible and easy to turn. However, once you start moving up in speed, you maybe feeling you've reached the limit, where you want a stiffer or bigger ski to eat up some of the shock
post #10 of 18

What he said, in fact Atomic states on their website it's "ideal for newcomers" while the Nordica was designed for intermediates.  I don't know what you mean by "higher speeds," but if you seriously like skiing fast, you could easily find yourself in a pretty unstable situation with the Atomics.  Speed requires stiffness if you also want control so you probably do yourself a disservice by looking for soft skis.

post #11 of 18
Thread Starter 

The Atomics feel a LOT stiffer than my old overdrives did and they are wider and with newer technology (with a small bit of rocker) so from that respect, they are a step up from what I have skied on before,  but what is confusing me is that the Atomic website skill level indicator puts them at level 3-7 and then have statments like "ideal for newcomers". I would have thought the Nomad Smokes were the entry level skis and the colts were the next stage step up for progression. I know there not in the same league as Blackyes but I'm nervous about any skis with Ti due to my relativley low weight - I may rent some top end Ti skis on my trip to see how I get on with them !

 

 

post #12 of 18
Thread Starter 

Well, after some consideeration, I sold off the colts and ugraded to Blackeye Ti's.  I figured that these skis would see me over the next few years and would really help me to improve and allow me to grow into them. The colts were nice but just too "Beginnery" so hopefully I'll have fun on the Blackeyes next week...I'll let you know how I get on.

Oh, they are 167's

 

 

post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belmontboy View Post

Well, after some consideeration, I sold off the colts and ugraded to Blackeye Ti's.  I figured that these skis would see me over the next few years and would really help me to improve and allow me to grow into them. The colts were nice but just too "Beginnery" so hopefully I'll have fun on the Blackeyes next week...I'll let you know how I get on.

Oh, they are 167's

 

 



i think that you made a good decision.  Now just make sure you stay forward on those Blackeye's and you'll be fine.  Stiff skis are great (and not too hard to handle) if you stay on top of them and don't let them push you around.

post #14 of 18

Line Profit 100's for sure.  They are my everyday ski.

post #15 of 18
Thread Starter 

I TAMED THE BLACKEYES !!!! Amazing Ski

 

I have just returned from 6 days skiing in The Three Valleys in France and loved the Blackeyes.

Snow conditions were VERY variable and were perhaps the most variable I had ever seen having skied in this area every two years since 1997. Potentialy excllenet runs were slush baths by mid afternoon and even the "ever perfect" Grand Lac blue run was chopped up 2:30 pm.

This meant, however, that I could test the Blackeye Ti's in a variety of conditons but also meant that they tested my own phyisical endurance !

 

(1) Ice - Edge grip on morning ice was fantastic and the skis inspired confidence and felt stable. Carving turns could be achieved allthough skid turns were used often to control speed. The edges of the skis are still razor sharp.

 

(2) Groomed Pistes - This is where the skis really impressed. They  were fast, agile and easy to turn and simply bounced over any bumps. The high temperatures on these days, however, meant that these nicely groomed red's and blues became slushy very quiclkly.

 

(3) Slush and Crud.  The skis simply floated over the slush and crud. This is when, however, I felt I had to work hard to get the best of them. After 3 days, my technique was good but I was fatiguing quickly. The ESF instructor said not to fight the slush and just ski on throught it. This did work but stopping required hard pressure which was hard work.

 

(4) Moguls - I took a trip from Les Menuires to Corcheval and met a few red runs that had become "mogul" ridden.  I loved the way the skis just bounced from mogul to mogul and my technique in this area improved greatly.  Of course, the last piste into Les Menuires was like slush puppy and I had a bad case of "jelly legs" but it was well worth the trip to Corcheval.

 

(5) Uneven chopped Terrain - As the skis are firm, any hard bumps are felt immediatly and casued me to tense my legs a fair bit, particlarly on dull days when it was hard to see.  The ESF instructor said to relax and just take the bumps without tensing up. This helped a lot and I was soon able to cope with chopped up Terrain,particlarly the red "Becca" run in Les Menuires and the reds of Val Thorens.

 

Overall, these are  great skis and the most important thing about them is that they tested MY limits, rather than me testing the limits of the skis. With the variable conditions, I feel I didn't really get them out of "3rd Gear" and I know they can do more.  I can't wait to go out next season and let these baby's take me to the next level.

 

post #16 of 18

Sorry I missed this thread originally. I'm exactly your weight and I would have countered the advice to avoid metal layers. I've skied wood/metal skis since 1990 and no other construction works as well for me. Metal needn't mean too stiff, especially with today's rockered designs, and it provides stability at speed and edgehold on hard snow that I don't get otherwise. Glad to see you made this discovery!

 

I actually ski the Blackeye Ti's @ 167cm and love them. If I skied only groomers, crud and powder I'd choose the 174s but for all-terrain (especially bumps and trees) this length works better.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Belmontboy View Post

I TAMED THE BLACKEYES !!!! Amazing Ski

 

I have just returned from 6 days skiing in The Three Valleys in France and loved the Blackeyes.

Snow conditions were VERY variable and were perhaps the most variable I had ever seen having skied in this area every two years since 1997. Potentialy excllenet runs were slush baths by mid afternoon and even the "ever perfect" Grand Lac blue run was chopped up 2:30 pm.

This meant, however, that I could test the Blackeye Ti's in a variety of conditons but also meant that they tested my own phyisical endurance !

 

(1) Ice - Edge grip on morning ice was fantastic and the skis inspired confidence and felt stable. Carving turns could be achieved allthough skid turns were used often to control speed. The edges of the skis are still razor sharp. Agreed. Keep your weight ahead of your heels and they'll hold like a race ski. If you try to work the tails hard they'll wash out, that's the difference between these and race skis. Do play with that though. You'll learn the Blackeye's limits and something about your own balance and movement skills too, which will build more confidence.

 

(2) Groomed Pistes - This is where the skis really impressed. Agreed. Steer them WAAAAY out to the side and just stand quietly and centered. Trust them. They'll swoop amazing, controllable arcs at any speed. In fact, as long as you're arcing them the faster you go the better they work... FUN!!! They  were fast, agile and easy to turn and simply bounced over any bumps. The high temperatures on these days, however, meant that these nicely groomed red's and blues became slushy very quiclkly.

 

(3) Slush and Crud.  The skis simply floated over the slush and crud. This is when, however, I felt I had to work hard to get the best of them. After 3 days, my technique was good but I was fatiguing quickly. If your technique were good then you wouldn't be fading so quickly, wink.gif. The ESF instructor said not to fight the slush and just ski on throught it. This did work but stopping required hard pressure which was hard work. So don't stop! biggrin.gif Don't even think about stopping, seriously. Just steer and ride the skis toward where you want them to go. The trick to skiing crud without exhaustion is to keep both skis equally weighted (so they don't diverge or cross) and ride them in arcs. Always be turning. Except at the moment of transition your skis should always be out to one side or the other. Be RELAXED and stand TALL. Crouching over will put you in the back seat and burn out your quads.

 

(4) Moguls - I took a trip from Les Menuires to Corcheval and met a few red runs that had become "mogul" ridden.  I loved the way the skis just bounced from mogul to mogul and my technique in this area improved greatly.  Of course, the last piste into Les Menuires was like slush puppy and I had a bad case of "jelly legs" but it was well worth the trip to Corcheval. I like the Blackeye's in bumps. They aren't noodles so they enforce a bit of discipline, but the tips have just enough give so they won't launch you into the next valley.

 

(5) Uneven chopped Terrain - As the skis are firm, any hard bumps are felt immediatly and casued me to tense my legs a fair bit, particlarly on dull days when it was hard to see.  Never tense your legs! I once took a bump clinic in thick fog and one of the other students complained about the visibility. In response, the instructor put his helmet on BACKWARDS and skied 10 turns straight down the fall line - completely blind. He had us do it too, skiing 100% by feel. The ESF instructor said to relax and just take the bumps without tensing up. This helped a lot and I was soon able to cope with chopped up Terrain,particlarly the red "Becca" run in Les Menuires and the reds of Val Thorens. That's a good instructor. Skiing bumps well requires relaxed feet and ankles. Start each turn by just rolling those totally relaxed feet downhill (especially the new inside foot). All else will follow. You can control your turn shape and scrape off some speed with bigger leg movements later in the turn, but start each turn by just rolling those relaxed feet. Hint: if you can't wiggle your toes, you're not relaxed enough. smile.gif

 

Overall, these are  great skis and the most important thing about them is that they tested MY limits, rather than me testing the limits of the skis. Bingo! With the variable conditions, I feel I didn't really get them out of "3rd Gear" and I know they can do more.  I can't wait to go out next season and let these baby's take me to the next level. cool.gif

 


 Great report. Enjoy the Blackeye's.

 

post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belmontboy View Post

I TAMED THE BLACKEYES !!!! Amazing Ski

 

I have just returned from 6 days skiing in The Three Valleys in France and loved the Blackeyes.

Snow conditions were VERY variable and were perhaps the most variable I had ever seen having skied in this area every two years since 1997. Potentialy excllenet runs were slush baths by mid afternoon and even the "ever perfect" Grand Lac blue run was chopped up 2:30 pm.

This meant, however, that I could test the Blackeye Ti's in a variety of conditons but also meant that they tested my own phyisical endurance !

 

(1) Ice - Edge grip on morning ice was fantastic and the skis inspired confidence and felt stable. Carving turns could be achieved allthough skid turns were used often to control speed. The edges of the skis are still razor sharp.

 

(2) Groomed Pistes - This is where the skis really impressed. They  were fast, agile and easy to turn and simply bounced over any bumps. The high temperatures on these days, however, meant that these nicely groomed red's and blues became slushy very quiclkly.

 

(3) Slush and Crud.  The skis simply floated over the slush and crud. This is when, however, I felt I had to work hard to get the best of them. After 3 days, my technique was good but I was fatiguing quickly. The ESF instructor said not to fight the slush and just ski on throught it. This did work but stopping required hard pressure which was hard work.

 

(4) Moguls - I took a trip from Les Menuires to Corcheval and met a few red runs that had become "mogul" ridden.  I loved the way the skis just bounced from mogul to mogul and my technique in this area improved greatly.  Of course, the last piste into Les Menuires was like slush puppy and I had a bad case of "jelly legs" but it was well worth the trip to Corcheval.

 

(5) Uneven chopped Terrain - As the skis are firm, any hard bumps are felt immediatly and casued me to tense my legs a fair bit, particlarly on dull days when it was hard to see.  The ESF instructor said to relax and just take the bumps without tensing up. This helped a lot and I was soon able to cope with chopped up Terrain,particlarly the red "Becca" run in Les Menuires and the reds of Val Thorens.

 

Overall, these are  great skis and the most important thing about them is that they tested MY limits, rather than me testing the limits of the skis. With the variable conditions, I feel I didn't really get them out of "3rd Gear" and I know they can do more.  I can't wait to go out next season and let these baby's take me to the next level.

 

 

Too funny - I was in the Trois Vallees from 16 March to the 24th as well, staying in Reberty Les Menuires,  and also on the Blackeye Ti.  Only difference was that I was on 174s (I weigh 170 lb).  It was my first time out there, and it was an EPIC trip.  I think that the conditions were probably a little firmer than they were when you were out there last week, but spring was definitely creeping in.  It's amazing how variable the conditions can be in different valleys and at different altitudes. There's one run from Dent de Buron in Courchevel to Meribel that was 4300 vertical feet of spring bumps, and quite slushy at the bottom.  A day earlier I was skiing windscraped ice on the glacier Thorens.  The Blackeyes handled it all, of course.

 

post #18 of 18
Thread Starter 

Wow !

 

Reberty was just along from us (our hotel was just under the wooden millenium spire that you can see in Les menuires).  This is the 10th time I have skied there and I would say that the conditions in 2006 and 2008 were FANTASTIC compared to this year. Even althought this year was good, in those years, the pistes just seemed to stay in perfect condition for the whole day and the only slush and crud was at low altitude such as the final run towards les menuires and the final descent into Motaret just before the Pa du Lac bubble.

 

Runs like Alamands, David Douliet, Quatre Vents, Venturon, Lac de Chambre etc etc had their good times this year, but I remember these runs being fantastic for hours and hours on end in 2006 and 2008.

 

I've always loved the Val Thorens Glacier run, and most of the runs in Val T.  Only regret is that I have to wait two whole years before I go back !

 

Blackeyes were awsome though !

 

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