Waxing your own skis, alternatives to $50 "ski iron" etc... - Page 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atomicman 

Uh, that was a joke, Stainless Steel Appliances, A Delorean? U clean 'em with Windex!

 

Ski the Steel, Steal the Thunder!

Oh yeah that's right, my bad, I forgot, with you it's a joke when it's not funny, and funny when you are dead serious.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost 

 

How about an engineering approach?

 

It really doesn't matter where you bought it or what it's called; hat matters is what it is.

 

...

 

Is the temperature controlled to a narrow enough temperature range?  The iron may shut off get too cold, turn on and get too hot before turning off again.  It's not easy to tell how well the temperature cycle will work without trying it, but you can compensate by moving the iron faster when it's hotter and slower when it's colder.  Don't smoke the wax!, feel your skis top sheets with your hands.

I was recently back home in Ontario for a couple of months and couch surfing for that time. I had to iron my clothes at a friend's place, and discovered that his iron would literally drop from essentially "off" to burning in order to reach the temperature setting. So a swing of 30 degrees is a real understatement. 

The problem is that by the time you've discovered this flaw, you've already spent possibly $15+ on your crap iron and now need to buy a better one. May as well spend the $40 for the ski waxing iron instead. (This only applies if you're buying new. I suppose if you're buying used, you could waste several iron purchases and still come out on top. But again, what's your time worth...)

^^^ that is the reason for the Mass.  A light iron will not hold heat well.

BTW don't use your clothes iron, unless you want to have wax on your clothes instead of starch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad Hall 

1 video also mentioned Scotchbrite, more left that part out and said "...scrape, brush, done". What does Scotchbrite do that a brush doesn't?

Sorry for the late reply, thought I already had... hence my handle.

The brush is to expose the structure, the pad is to buff off the hairs that are exposed.

Procedure: wipe base, brush (brass), wax, cool, scrape, scotchbrite, brush (nylon), (check for excess wax and scrape again if necessary) scotchbrite, and brush again (nylon or horsehair).

Spacecase

I know!  I mean that old tape cassette case that I use for scraping instead of the Plexiglass swix scraper, it's no wonder that I can even ski on those things, and lets not forget just filling those pits with more wax instead of using P-tex! HOLY CRAP!!!  How do they slide, HOW DO THEY SLIDE???!!!!  Oh and lets not forget the HOUSE HOLD IRON that I used and still use, THE DAMAGE!  RED ALERT!  TEMPERATURE VARIATIONS!  THE HUMANITY!     Oh and the combination of my low post count and shameful waxing practices must mean that, YES, YES, I must really suck at skiing too....  I'm damned for sure, I should just stay at home this winter...         

Thank you volantaddict for throwing some much needed humor and realism into this thread!  :)  
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by volantaddict 

Cheap bastard! Why would you destroy your skis with news paper, when you could be buying these paper towels for only $9.95?

 

 

 

 

 

 

After all, they are made for the job, and if you use something else you are a very bad person who wants your skis to burst into flames and leave nothing but a smoking crater where your tuning shop used to be. Stop using less expensive alternatives! Your skis will never slide again and your entire life will unravel! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You're welcome for my advice on how best to spend your money.

 

 

This thread is stating to be as much fun as tuning my skis!

My main reason for buying the tools and doing it myself, was to teach my two teenage boys how to care for their skis. And more important lesson was to teach them to take good care of the expensive toys that I buy for them. ( I will let you know if it worked, but right now I have to go get #1 sons truck from the body shop) 

I used to obsess over waxing/scraping/brushing... 'til i started skiing more and it was taking up too much time. So I bought a few kilo's of all temperature wax and a cheap Toko wax iron. Now I drip just enough to cover the base, thoroughly iron it in, and leave it alone! The next day I go ski... The first two runs will do a good job of scraping the base.

It's like cycling - you can wash your bike and clean/lube the chain after every ride, but good grief, it's not necessary.

:)

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwoof2 

Now I drip just enough to cover the base, thoroughly iron it in, and leave it alone! The next day I go ski... The first two runs will do a good job of scraping the base.

 

You can simply ski down the stairs in front of the lodge to perform a quick scrape before the first run.

This has turned into one of the worst threads on here, w/ the exception of VA's advice.  Way to c it up.

Everyone is certainly free to maintain thier gear as they see fit.

I know I'm a phucking capitalist pig for using a $119.00 digital wax iron.

Guess I'm part of the 1%..............................................sheesh

I wasn't exactly referring to you specifically, but the thread is asking for cheap maintenance advice.  And VA is right that this whole forum is riddled with people that absolutely obsess about their edges.  Before I came to this website, I bought boots that were 2 sizes too big, bought skis and boots strictly because they were on last year's half off rack, and I never got a tune on my skis and never waxed them.  Once in a great while i would rub on some liquid toko, and that was it.  My point being, that I used to go to Kirkwood 60 days a year, on shhhtuff that wasn't right for me at all, and I had a great time.  My buddy that has a place near K-wood said my old skis are still at his cabin and i'm going back for the first time in 9 years this winter, and i cannot wait to check out what kind of condition all that stuff is in, just to see how crappy the stuff i used to use really is. 

I have two pairs of 9-year old skis that are pretty good, and an antique pair that is just a little floppier than it should be (still quite stiff by today's standard though).  Just because it's old doesn't mean it's rubbish.

No, my old atomic tweaks, one of the first twin tips i think, I'm pretty sure are beat, even if you have good old skis.  I'm pretty sure I beat the crap out of these, but I wouldn't doubt that they could be good as new with a fresh tune!  I'm positive whatever crappy bindings i put on them are indemnified, too.

Of course you could always do what I do and kill two birds with one stone......put your skis on the roof rack, bases up, and hit the car wash and pay the extra buck for the wax cycle

Quote:

Originally Posted by bud heishman 

Of course you could always do what I do and kill two birds with one stone......put your skis on the roof rack, bases up, and hit the car wash and pay the extra buck for the wax cycle

Do you roll out to the desert and find a dust storm to buff them out?

I actually took my old ski's to the Alamosa Sand Dunes,  (colorado) and skied down the sand dunes for a 3 days, while camping out there.  My ski bases were amazingly smooth but needless to say the bindings didn't fare well with the sand...     word, Pledge works great as a wax while skiing sand.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwoof2 

I used to obsess over waxing/scraping/brushing... 'til i started skiing more and it was taking up too much time. So I bought a few kilo's of all temperature wax and a cheap Toko wax iron. Now I drip just enough to cover the base, thoroughly iron it in, and leave it alone! The next day I go ski... The first two runs will do a good job of scraping the base.

I tried this a few times, but quickly realized that:

1. The ski wax does not get evenly worn of the ski base (even after 20+ runs)
2. The structure does not get opened up correctly and as I stated in my earlier post it's all about the base structure for me

If you hot wax and don't scrape you end up with a ski that's probably moving through the snow even slower than if you had done nothing at all.  It will also be a fairly inconsistent ride with unpredictable response at times.

It takes about the same time to crayon, cork, and brush as it does to put down a layer of hot wax.  I'm going to speed up my process even more this season going to power drill cork cylinders and roto brushes.  Of course this thread is about "cheap" methods and those tools certainly aren't cheap.

You are assuming the non scrapers can actually carve a turn on groomed.

If you are skidding down the hill like a pair of Semi-Truck wipers on High, what difference does it make.

If you you actually ski using your edges for more then making snowcone fodder, a bunch of wax on your bases is definetly in your way!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noodler 

 

 

 

I tried this a few times, but quickly realized that:

 

1. The ski wax does not get evenly worn of the ski base (even after 20+ runs)
2. The structure does not get opened up correctly and as I stated in my earlier post it's all about the base structure for me

 

If you hot wax and don't scrape you end up with a ski that's probably moving through the snow even slower than if you had done nothing at all.  It will also be a fairly inconsistent ride with unpredictable response at times.

 

It takes about the same time to crayon, cork, and brush as it does to put down a layer of hot wax.  I'm going to speed up my process even more this season going to power drill cork cylinders and roto brushes.  Of course this thread is about "cheap" methods and those tools certainly aren't cheap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noodler 

 

 

 

I tried this a few times, but quickly realized that:

 

1. The ski wax does not get evenly worn of the ski base (even after 20+ runs)
2. The structure does not get opened up correctly and as I stated in my earlier post it's all about the base structure for me

 

If you hot wax and don't scrape you end up with a ski that's probably moving through the snow even slower than if you had done nothing at all. 

Depends.  On spring corn the ski is scraped perfectly in half a run.

In powder it is never scraped.

As far as being slow, That depends as well.  I went skiing with a friend on day who got to the mountain and had forgotten to scrape.  He and I are both ex-racers who know how to tune and wax, and don't like slow skis.  My skis were well waxed, scraped, and brushed, but his skis were actually faster for the first few runs.  After that I became less religious about scraping.  I ought to note, that I have seen the opposite, and even returned to the car to scrape once.  (We still have ski in ski out parking here)

Waxing skies is a lot like survival camp training:

If you get lost in the woods, sit down, pull out your Arkansas Stone and start sharpening your knife.

Within 5 minutes 20 people will walk by and tell you you're doing it wrong. Just follow one of them.

I've had the opportunity to watch World Cup Tuners; tune, wax, and scrape skies. The one thing they all share; tune your skies the same way every time.

Hermann Maier tech would wire brush his skies back and forth. He said "it didn't matter, the final wax and final brush was all that mattered"

Based on Hermann's record he must know what he's talking about.

Time permitting, I wax my skies after ever full day of skiing. Wax a on, wax a off......

When I have time for it, I like to wax, tune etc properly. I enjoy myself doing it while enjoying a warm or cold beverage. I got a Swix T73 as a gift this fall. In 30 years + I've used a household iron, it got the job done and I only once burnt my bases ( too many cold ones ). The Swix iron is better IMO, and given its quality I wont ever need another iron.

If I don't have the time for a proper waxing ( i.e. leaving home around 8 am and returning 11 pm ) I have a Swix liquid wax, also great great for waxing students' skis on the hill. My skis will always be waxed and brushed, I use a brass brush both before and after waxing. I believe that a waxed and tuned ski turns easier, glides better and gives me more fun.

I don't trust my  freehand filing skills and always use a fileguide. ( And I'm quite anal when it comes to edges ) 

YMMV - I'd be most surprised to see us all agree on anything tuning-related.

In the meanwhile, let's make sure 4ster wont have much tune-time this season and vote for him :

http://wildfireapp.com/website/6/contests/137512/voteable_entries/33069954?page=2

More than a few folks in the alpine snowboard community have found success with the Wax Whizard: http://www.alpineskituning.com/raysway.waxwhiz.htm

While I am still a fan of hot waxing, this is so fast and effective that I found myself hot waxing a lot less - maybe once every 10 days on the now, as opposed to every third day, and percieved better results.

YMMV, of course, but for twenty bucks, it's money well spent, IMHO.

Rays Wax Wizard was first show to me by none other than Mike DeSantis, tuner extraordinaire. I haven't tried it myself, but I've heard very good things about Rays products. Best thing is that first timers don't need to worry about overheating the bases.

Mike

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctskierguy 

Rays Wax Wizard was first show to me by none other than Mike DeSantis, tuner extraordinaire. I haven't tried it myself, but I've heard very good things about Rays products. Best thing is that first timers don't need to worry about overheating the bases.

 

Mike

Yeah, Mike and PTC have got quite the reputation amongst hardbooters for doing some of the best race prep around.  I believe there's several peeps west of the Mississippi, who have their stuff shipped out to Mike for work.  A few customers go as far as to tell Donek/Prior/Coiler to ship new decks straight to him, before they even touch snow.  He is how I came to know Ray's products.  I only use the waxing one, but it does the job and does it well.

Edit: Apparently, Mike is doing well for himself - Precision Tuning Center has now been renamed SkiMD and it looks like they're in a new, bigger space: http://www.skimd.com/

PS - I'm new here, so if everybody already knows who Mike is and what he does, my apologies.  No affiliation with him or Summit Ski & Snowboard, BTW.

Mike was the one that pointed me towards the Wax Whizard too.  I use it for touch ups between hot cyclings and to get an even coat of wax on prior to hot waxing.  This way I know the hot iron will never be in direct contact with an unprotected base.

Does it make a difference?  I think so but can't prove it.  I do it because I had a pair of skis delaminate and it was probably from excissive heat (Mike pointed that out too ).  So, I take extra precautions.

There are very few "chores" I enjoy doing.  Tuning skis is one that I do enjoy.  Especially as madMads stated "...while enjoying a warm or cold beverage..."  My preference is Anderson Valley' Brewing Company's Barney Flats Oatmeal Stout. 

I'm sure someone will post I can get the same alcohol content by drinking Bud Light or the like.

Ken

Roto-corking is also a very easy (tried and true) method to generate friction heat. It's great for powders, liquid and paste overlays as well as quick touch ups with crayoning solids.

I've also been experimenting with a heat gun and fan nozzle with positive results for quick touch ups with pastes and liquids on pattern based skis.

Quote:

Originally Posted by volantaddict 

Apparently deriving meaning from written words is beyond you too. No one ever said that appreciating a good tool is snooty or snobby.

 

This thread was started by someone who was looking for alternatives to buying a waxing specific iron. Snooty snobs cannot even admit that there is any alternative to buying one, and instead of taking into consideration the request of the thread starter, they push the idea that there is no other functional course besides shelling out money like they did. When someone gives a suggestion of how to get results with much less expense, they are  reviled by snobs for being cheap.

 

Heh, if 3-7 years  is all you get out of one of those fancy irons (I really doubt they die that fast), then they are a real rip off; I've been using my bottom of the line clothes iron for eight years (well, last year probably only a dozen or so times, but I've done hundreds of wax jobs with no problems).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought you said you don't wax your skis that often?  Now you've done hundreds of pairs?  Which is it?

Listen Pal, I'm the cheapest sob you'll ever meet.  I never pay full price for anything...not even close.  I'm the guy that sales men go back to their boss and complain about. I constantly make sure that I am buying something at the best possible rate for myself.  However, that doesn't mean I always buy the cheapest thing.  I do sometimes, but sometimes I buy a high end item if it suits my needs better. Whatever the case, I make sure I am getting the best deal.

Like I said before, why would you spend a $hit ton of money on skis and not spend a relatively cheap amount to make sure they are performing at their best.  Before you say "oh well my brah gives me my skis through prodeal" or "I only buy used" I guarantee you that you have some higher end, expert level skis if you are posting on this forum, and specifically in the tuning section... So maybe this analogy will work for you: Not putting a little bit of money into ski tuning on your high end skis is akin to having a sports car and buying used tires that have no grip. Why not help your vehicle perform at its best?

Wow.    "Listen Pal?"

God the east coast sucks.

Buying used tires that have no grip? ........       oh brother what a bad analogy.   Maybe it's just me but I don't think a tune job is important when I am skiing powder, just making sure that I have the right temp wax on my ski's or at least close to it is good enough for me.  But then again i am not skiing out east,  (giggle).  

Originally Posted by Blizzboy283 

I thought you said you don't wax your skis that often?  Now you've done hundreds of pairs?  Which is it?

 

Listen Pal, I'm the cheapest sob you'll ever meet.  I never pay full price for anything...not even close.  I'm the guy that sales men go back to their boss and complain about. I constantly make sure that I am buying something at the best possible rate for myself.  However, that doesn't mean I always buy the cheapest thing.  I do sometimes, but sometimes I buy a high end item if it suits my needs better. Whatever the case, I make sure I am getting the best deal.

 

Like I said before, why would you spend a $hit ton of money on skis and not spend a relatively cheap amount to make sure they are performing at their best.  Before you say "oh well my brah gives me my skis through prodeal" or "I only buy used" I guarantee you that you have some higher end, expert level skis if you are posting on this forum, and specifically in the tuning section... So maybe this analogy will work for you: Not putting a little bit of money into ski tuning on your high end skis is akin to having a sports car and buying used tires that have no grip. Why not help your vehicle perform at its best?

Based on VA's trip reports, I don't think he's having any issues using his equipment.  Also, the benefits of tuning are better felt on race courses, extreme cold or warm conditions, and groomers.  If you're dodging trees and hitting chutes on the back of Snowbowl, your tune is the LEAST of your worries.  
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blizzboy283 

Quote:

Originally Posted by volantaddict 

Apparently deriving meaning from written words is beyond you too. No one ever said that appreciating a good tool is snooty or snobby.

 

This thread was started by someone who was looking for alternatives to buying a waxing specific iron. Snooty snobs cannot even admit that there is any alternative to buying one, and instead of taking into consideration the request of the thread starter, they push the idea that there is no other functional course besides shelling out money like they did. When someone gives a suggestion of how to get results with much less expense, they are  reviled by snobs for being cheap.

 

Heh, if 3-7 years  is all you get out of one of those fancy irons (I really doubt they die that fast), then they are a real rip off; I've been using my bottom of the line clothes iron for eight years (well, last year probably only a dozen or so times, but I've done hundreds of wax jobs with no problems).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought you said you don't wax your skis that often?  Now you've done hundreds of pairs?  Which is it?

 

Listen Pal, I'm the cheapest sob you'll ever meet.  I never pay full price for anything...not even close.  I'm the guy that sales men go back to their boss and complain about. I constantly make sure that I am buying something at the best possible rate for myself.  However, that doesn't mean I always buy the cheapest thing.  I do sometimes, but sometimes I buy a high end item if it suits my needs better. Whatever the case, I make sure I am getting the best deal.

 

Like I said before, why would you spend a $hit ton of money on skis and not spend a relatively cheap amount to make sure they are performing at their best.  Before you say "oh well my brah gives me my skis through prodeal" or "I only buy used" I guarantee you that you have some higher end, expert level skis if you are posting on this forum, and specifically in the tuning section... So maybe this analogy will work for you: Not putting a little bit of money into ski tuning on your high end skis is akin to having a sports car and buying used tires that have no grip. Why not help your vehicle perform at its best?