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Nobis Arrested for DUI a fouth time! - Page 3

post #61 of 84

saw On the Road, no Nobis?

post #62 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post

 but it is only by the grace of God that I didn't end up in a DWI crash in my younger years.



You aren't the only one.  When I look at what I've done, with Zero DUI's, I shudder to think what the whole history is for someone with four.  There is a point where I don't give a hoot about rehabilitating, I just want him locked away to keep the rest of us safe.

 

post #63 of 84

i dont get it. Ski towns are notorious for dui enforcement. This guy had so many chances to adjust his lifestyle, install a breathalyzer lock on his car, get a girlfriend who would drive,get an apprentice to drive,get a man servant to drive, learn crosscountry routes with a dirtbike. First time bad luck,second time stupid,third time moronic and four something else going on

post #64 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by crgildart View Post


 



I believe the Federal Americans with Disabilities Act would prevent that from happening.  Since alcoholism is a disease alcoholics have some protection as long as they can provide evidence they are treating the disorder or that it is in remission (AKA they are sober).  Taking someones license permanently for their 2nd DUI is like taking an epileptics license permanently for having seizures while driving.  If they can submit medical proof that they have their disease under control the state has to allow them to obtain a drivers license.




In Massachusetts -the 5th offense is a lifetime ban with no exclusions.   DUI's 2-4 get mandatory long revocations with multi-year waits to even apply for a hardship reinstating.  Like being blind-your "disability" can be the reason you aren't allowed to drive. 

 

Now as for the perversity of calling Alcoholism a disability-let's see what our good friends in South Park Have to say:

 

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155147/dads-drunk

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/103662/randys-dui

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/103665/i-just-really-like-beer

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155157/daddys-very-sick#tab=related

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155164/were-all-powerless#tab=related

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155180/4-beers#tab=related  

 

This last one hits the nail on the head...dang, just watching these reminds me of how dead-on these guys are..just exchange Mr. Marsh with Jeremy Nobis.

 

 

 

 

 

 

post #65 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by crgildart View Post
In this day and age knowing there are a few (very few) people that are too impaired to drive at that level .08% we all have to stay in, skip the booze altogether, or arrange for transportation.  

Uh, hate to rain on you guys' parade, but .08 is significantly impaired, if you mean by that, reflex reactions, problem solving, other standard neuro measures. Major literature on this, over decades. And a "three drink dinner" is not what most people would consider normal drinking, to be followed by driving home. Try a glass of wine, or maybe a cocktail before, to make your analogy work. Intelligent people who plan to drink walk, take a cab, subway, or have a D.D.

 

What's funny is that your statement is almost a parody, but as far as I can tell, you believe it. Everyone thinks they can handle it, their bodies metabolize ethanol differently than the average guy, their reflexes and decisions aren't affected, it's those "very few" others that get impaired and ruin it for the rest of us supermen. After all, we can still talk without slurring, walk normally, and drive a car as if we're perfectly normal. And our buddies always have told us how they can't even tell we've been drinking. Uh huh. Wait until someone cuts right in front of you after one of those three drink dinners and see how stupendous your driving is...rolleyes.gif
 

 

post #66 of 84

My personal myth, though beyond is correct, is that some people do get drunk differently than others. Some people change their personality completely, which I always mistrust. Some people seem to desire to let go of control and let circumstances take over. These are desires and drives (self destructive and self hate) that lie just below the surface. As many here have said: how did I drink and drive for 40 years and never get pulled over or crash? No subconscious destructive drive, IMO.

post #67 of 84

Alcoholics will experience improved performance while BAC is increasing.  They become stimulated.  When they stop, that's when trouble occurs.  An alcoholic might be able to drive home after 2 six packs if the drive is short.  But increase the distance and the driving will deteriorate significantly.

 

Alcohol acts as a stimulant and a depressant.  Many people forget about the stimulating influence. 

post #68 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by davluri View Post
how did I drink and drive for 40 years and never get pulled over or crash? No subconscious destructive drive, IMO.

Agree. But statisticians would say, probability. Maybe you just haven't drawn the short straw. Yet.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Jones View Post

Alcoholics will experience improved performance while BAC is increasing.  They become stimulated.  When they stop, that's when trouble occurs.  An alcoholic might be able to drive home after 2 six packs if the drive is short.  But increase the distance and the driving will deteriorate significantly.

 

Alcohol acts as a stimulant and a depressant.  Many people forget about the stimulating influence. 


Paul, I know that alcohol acts as a stimulant in low doses, but does that = improved driving performance? Under the impression that driving performance requires not just doing something quickly, but making the right call about what's likely to happen next instant. Recall when I drove a motorcycle that the average driver processes 200 discrete bits of information requiring some action every second. (Ranging from feedback through the steering wheel to what that guy's doing two lanes to the right to what that sign says, you get the idea.) Hard to see from the literature that even if alcohol provides a subjective sensation of stimulation (which may not be the same thing as improved reflexes at the wheel), it's also leading to better decisions. It's a disinhibiter, for one thing. meaning that you're less likely to choose a response that's proven lower risk in the past. For another, it slows down processing in the prefrontal cortex, even at low doses. But I don't know the lit on alcoholics as much as on non-alcoholics (or animal models). th_dunno-1[1].gif Maybe all you alcoholics out there would like to comment on your driving skills...BTW, the average motorcyclist is facing 2,000 discrete bits of data per second. If you really truly think having a .08 makes you more effective, try it on a bike, and go for the Darwin Award. wink.gif

 

post #69 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post



Uh, hate to rain on you guys' parade, but .08 is significantly impaired, if you mean by that, reflex reactions, problem solving, other standard neuro measures. Major literature on this, over decades. And a "three drink dinner" is not what most people would consider normal drinking, to be followed by driving home. Try a glass of wine, or maybe a cocktail before, to make your analogy work. Intelligent people who plan to drink walk, take a cab, subway, or have a D.D.

 

What's funny is that your statement is almost a parody, but as far as I can tell, you believe it. Everyone thinks they can handle it, their bodies metabolize ethanol differently than the average guy, their reflexes and decisions aren't affected, it's those "very few" others that get impaired and ruin it for the rest of us supermen. After all, we can still talk without slurring, walk normally, and drive a car as if we're perfectly normal. And our buddies always have told us how they can't even tell we've been drinking. Uh huh. Wait until someone cuts right in front of you after one of those three drink dinners and see how stupendous your driving is...rolleyes.gif
 

 


Umm, I haven't had a drink in over 12 years.  So, you're a bit off in your assumptions about what I believe here.  However, when I did drink 3 didn't phase me at all.  Heck, I often did a shot and two drinks before graduate school exams and did quite well.  But, for me it's all night or nothing so I choose nothing these days.  I know others that one or two drinks hit a lot harder.  Also age is a factor.   as we grow in years our livers and other organs get less efficient.

 

post #70 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post



 I know that alcohol acts as a stimulant in low doses, but does that = improved driving performance?


No it does not.  The key is that when an alcoholic is actively drinking he will or at least can manage well - when he stops, performance drops drastically.  So you can be with someone who appears to be fine even though he is pounding drinks, only to become a mess 20 - 30 min later.  Many of these people are the ones you read about in the paper.

 

post #71 of 84

.24, holy shiza. I dont know a single person that would even consider driving at that level, i know guys that can walk straight at that level but they still wouldnt consider driving. Well at least he got caught before he killed himself or someone else. Hopefully he considers the consequences of his actions and stops this stupid crap.

post #72 of 84

Actually 0.08 or 0.10 maybe consider not driving.  0.24 = too far gone to consider anything.

http://www.drunkdrivingdefense.com/general/bac.htm  (I don't think they mean American beer).  0.08 is about chugged 4 drinks for a 170 lb man.  2 drinks = good to go.

post #73 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post

Actually 0.08 or 0.10 maybe consider not driving.  0.24 = too far gone to consider anything.

 


Well, he drove at 100 mph and evaded the police for at least a few blocks.  Did he wreck the car?  I wonder how well he could ski at .24? (shameless skiing related plug) That said, I'm one of those guys that believes that even though I believe that most can drive fine at .08... since there are a few that can not all cars should have some kind of interlok device set at .1 or somewhere around that.  As for obvious dangers, old people is another one we need to assess a lot more.  Two people have been killed in the past month in this city by old people backing over them and saying they though they had the foot on the brake when in fact their foot was on the gas.  One of them backed through a store and then burned a hole in the floor with the wheel spinning while the car was against the back wall of the store.  Neither one was ticketed.

 

post #74 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by crgildart View Post
Heck, I often did a shot and two drinks before graduate school exams and did quite well.

Now I'm impressed. In all honesty have never ever heard of anyone drinking prior to an exam in grad school. Afterwards, well...

 

And on same page about oldsters. We've had some children killed back here by old guys who "get confused" and mow them down. Personally covered (used to be a reporter long ago) a 80 year old who literally took out a small post office in a retirement community. Hit the accelerator instead of the brake, apparently, drove right through it like in an action movie. Didn't take his foot off the gas pedal, just froze up. No one was killed, several injuries, P.O. was scrap. He walked away, was driving again in a week. IMO, mandatory driving tests every two years after a certain age, say 70, to keep your license. (OK AARP, await your death threats.)

 

Other thing I don't get is how Nobis was still driving with 4 DUI's. If I were a judge, I'd have a hard time keeping a straight face hearing about the hardship someone faces if they lose their license for a while.

 

Techies: Is there not a way to prevent folks with suspended/revoked licenses from driving? Heavy ankle manacles with embedded chips would be optimal, but I was thinking more of just requiring car makers to have the chip in the ignition accept code from one's current license. Gets around issues of validity of breath tests, how good we think we are at driving with .08 (or .24) just for folks already found guilty of vehicular mayhem etc. 
 

 

post #75 of 84

Apparently there is a guy around here who leaves his Porsche running in the parking lot while he drinks in the bar, so that he doesn't have to start it up again after drinking. 

 

A chipped DL (or ignition), well, I guess you'd just use someone else's DL to start your engine for you. 

post #76 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by segbrown View Post

Apparently there is a guy around here who leaves his Porsche running in the parking lot while he drinks in the bar, so that he doesn't have to start it up again after drinking. 


Valet Parkingwink.gif

 

post #77 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post


In Massachusetts -the 5th offense is a lifetime ban with no exclusions.   DUI's 2-4 get mandatory long revocations with multi-year waits to even apply for a hardship reinstating.  Like being blind-your "disability" can be the reason you aren't allowed to drive. 

 



You can probably thank that Kennedy "Chap" for that... making Mass notorious for drunk driving and all..  "In the Commonwealth, if ya drive ya cahhh to the bahhh and try ta get back in ya cahhh wa gonna put ya behind bahhhhhhhs.."

post #78 of 84
Next up: Jail the people on cell phones.

Is it just as dangerous to talk on a cell phone as to drink and drive?
post #79 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirquerider View Post

Next up: Jail the people on cell phones.

Is it just as dangerous to talk on a cell phone as to drink and drive?


although I agree with you..

 

Nobis wasnt at ..068 he was at .24 . Kari wouldnt even be standing with that much booze in her system.

 

They would jail you in Germany for cell phone use while driving it is just as bad.

 

post #80 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylrwnzl View Post

Let me ask you this. If the person is ignorant enough to go out and get a fifth DUI, do you think he really is going to care if he has a little plastic card in his wallet saying he's licensed to drive? I'd say the majority of individuals whom have lost their license for DUI still drive, they just don't have a license to do it anymore. A license is simply that a license, the car goes with or without it.



So because we think people will break the law anyway, we should not have a reasonable law?

 

No offense but that is an extremely weak argument.  If they choose to break the law after we take their license away then we will deal with that accordingly.  We shouldn't just throw our hands up in the air and let them get away with it.

 

If you drive drunk, you should lose your license forever at one or two offenses.  If it were up to me you would also be charged with attempted murder.  Only by luck did you not kill someone, even though you knew you would be in danger of killing someone when you got behind the wheel.

 

There is no excuse for drunk driving, NONE.

 

The whole "alcoholism is a disease" think is weak also.  I guess any action by anyone nowadays can be justified by just saying you have a mental disorder.  

post #81 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicX View Post


The whole "alcoholism is a disease" think is weak also.  I guess any action by anyone nowadays can be justified by just saying you have a mental disorder.  



Killing (or almost killing) anyone for any reason can never be "justified" but possibly better rectified?  Paying $50K/year to give someone 3 hots and a cot including better medical care than 10% of the free people in this country isn't always the best solution either.


Edited by crgildart - 9/28/11 at 6:01pm
post #82 of 84


I never said we shouldn't create a law against it, I just don't think its going to work. My grandparents were nearly killed by a woman in CA 15 years ago who was drunk and had just left a state ordered methadone clinic. She decided she was through with life and tried to commit suicide by crashing head on into an 18 wheeler. She was so inebriated and high that she missed the semi and collided head on with my grandparents sending their car into a water filled ditch. They asked my parents to fly out to sign my grandfathers death certificate, but he ended up miraculously pulling through without a spleen, one less kidney, and a still fluid filled lung. Eventually leading to PTSD attributed diabetes and his current kidney failure. And guess what, she had no drivers license or insurance because of too many DUI's. So I am certain people will break that law. (And she did a grand total of 7 years in jail for that. How's that for "dealing accordingly"?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicX View Post

So because we think people will break the law anyway, we should not have a reasonable law?

 

No offense but that is an extremely weak argument.  If they choose to break the law after we take their license away then we will deal with that accordingly.  We shouldn't just throw our hands up in the air and let them get away with it.

 

If you drive drunk, you should lose your license forever at one or two offenses.  If it were up to me you would also be charged with attempted murder.  Only by luck did you not kill someone, even though you knew you would be in danger of killing someone when you got behind the wheel.

 

There is no excuse for drunk driving, NONE.

 

The whole "alcoholism is a disease" think is weak also.  I guess any action by anyone nowadays can be justified by just saying you have a mental disorder.  



 

post #83 of 84

Wow that is such a tragic story.  It really seems unfair that just because your grandfather was strong enough to pull through she got off with just 7 years in prison while he has a lifetime of suffering.

 

post #84 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicX View Post

Wow that is such a tragic story.  It really seems unfair that just because your grandfather was strong enough to pull through she got off with just 7 years in prison while he has a lifetime of suffering.

 



I wanted to double check to make sure I got all my details right. She didn't get seven she only got one year. The state ended up paying my grandparents some compensation because she was already broke and had no insurance. 

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