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Old bindings...toss them out.

post #1 of 21
3/1/11 at 7:23pm
Thread Starter 

As some of you may recall I have many old pairs of skis, they have been sitting around in my garage awaiting their fate (most will end up as lawn furniture).   One of the pairs looks to have been used for maybe one day, Elan Kevlar SRC 7.5, with equally new LOOK 3D 9DIN plastic bindings in white with purple accents, I decided they were too nice to cut up, so I mounted them in my home office wall.  

 

Last night I hear some strange noise in the office and I thought oh no the skis must have fallen off the wall mounts (I didn't drill through them).  Checked in and all was fine.    Today I see a heavy duty steel spring still with fresh grease on the floor and for the life of me I cannot figure out where it came from...then I look at the skis and realize that the heel portion of the bindings exploded on their own.   Mind you these bindings are like new, no rust, no damage, no wear.   They were not put on the wall in any sort of tension...I guess that temperature differential from when they were in the garage and now in the office was enough to make the plastic give.  

 

So if you are skiing on plastic relics.....you better think twice even if they are NOS.


Edited by Richie-Rich - 3/1/11 at 8:40pm
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post #2 of 21
3/1/11 at 8:07pm

Absolutely correct and thanks for the post.

 

As most folks know, I'm a retailer and I have this conversation with customers practically every day. While they may think think their bindings are just fine and that I'm trying to sell them something they don't need, the fact is that at some unpredictable point, those bindings deteriorate beyond "just fine" and graduate to downright dangerous. There are several reasons that binding manufacturers have seemingly arbitrary indemnification schedules. This is a perfect example of why they are not really arbitrary at all. Just b/c they "work" does not mean they are "right"

 

SJ

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post #3 of 21
3/1/11 at 10:02pm

I saw a guy on the hill today skiing Salomon 222's...with the optional brakes, they were mounted on Head Rustler II's. This set up was so scary bad that even I was unable to even come up with a snippy comment to the skier who was damn proud that he was skiing on 30 year old gear. 

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post #4 of 21
3/1/11 at 11:59pm

yep, I really cant figure out why somebody would be "proud" using bindings that old. Maybe they figure they are saving money? Maybe try to figure in the cost of a new knee then see how much they saved rolleyes.gif or rear entry boots that are cracking..shakes head.

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post #5 of 21
3/2/11 at 7:30am

So what is the realistic lifespan for the plastic bindings?

 

I have a pair of 1997ish Salomon 977s (plastic) that have been torque tested and passed, yet are still off the list.  I would expect them to be reasonable safe to ski, but I'm not sure how many more years I will keep that opinion.

 

I also have a set of all metal Salomon 957 Equipes from about 1993. Considering the Salomon binding tech really hasn't changed much from these, My thinking (which me be quite wrong) is that I would not be worried about these even on a daily ski, as long as they pass torque tests.

 

So... any consensus here?

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post #6 of 21
3/2/11 at 7:41am

The more metal the better especially in the spring housings. I wouldn't hesitate skiing an all metal Salomon Equipe or even Look/Rossi Z series from the 90's. The oldest I would go back in the Salomon IS the 957, the 747's toe wings were too short and had not a lot of elasticity. The Look RS series were mostly plastic and didn't hold well to the test of time. I don't have much experience with the Tyrolia 790 series from that era to endorse them one way or the other. Marker 48/51/54 series from that era again have very little elasticity but I have seen the least amount on visual failures. 

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post #7 of 21
3/2/11 at 8:29am

This may be a stupid question, but if the binding were to fail, how hard to you have to be skiing in order to be hurt?

 

I bought a pair of Rossis from the early 1980s, just to teach myself how to wax skis.  Would I be a complete idiot to take these for one run on an easy green before disposing of them?

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post #8 of 21
3/2/11 at 2:12pm

worthless.gif


 

I haven't seen a binder blown up in a few weeks, maybe because we almost no snow, but still!

 

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post #9 of 21
3/2/11 at 2:48pm
Thread Starter 

Ask and ye shall receive.   The heel piece doesn't even have ski pole gouges in it because like I said they appear to have been used maybe once, they are essentially new old stock.  I actually had to look around the room behind the furniture just now to find the other pieces, they shot out all over the place.

failed bindings 001.jpg

 

failed bindings 002.jpg

 

failed bindings 004.jpg

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post #10 of 21
3/3/11 at 7:29am


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post

 LOOK 3D 9DIN plastic bindings in white with purple accents, I decided they were too nice to cut up, so I mounted them in my home office wall.  

 

Last night I hear some strange noise in the office and I thought oh no the skis must have fallen off the wall mounts (I didn't drill through them).  Checked in and all was fine.    Today I see a heavy duty steel spring still with fresh grease on the floor and for the life of me I cannot figure out where it came from...then I look at the skis and realize that the heel portion of the bindings exploded on their own.   Mind you these bindings are like new, no rust, no damage, no wear.   They were not put on the wall in any sort of tension...I guess that temperature differential from when they were in the garage and now in the office was enough to make the plastic give.  

 

So if you are skiing on plastic relics.....you better think twice even if they are NOS.



 

Heh.  White plastic low-DIN Look 3D toepieces.   I have a collection of them, mostly with teal logos and graphics.   The heelcups all cracked off, in 1997 or sooner.

 

I think it isn't just the aging of the plastic.  I think that before the days of computer-driven FEA, stress design and testing of plastic parts was rudimentary at best.    I also think that the moulding processes of the day would leave hidden flaws inside the finished part.

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post #11 of 21
3/3/11 at 7:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by chase View Post

This may be a stupid question, but if the binding were to fail, how hard to you have to be skiing in order to be hurt?

 

I bought a pair of Rossis from the early 1980s, just to teach myself how to wax skis.  Would I be a complete idiot to take these for one run on an easy green before disposing of them?


This is as common to happen even when you are just clicking into the binding at start of a ski day. The Spring when In (or out) of the binding is in it's relaxed position:

 

OI/ / / / / / / /I

 

When you are entering the binding is when it compresses:

 

OI///////I

 

This cause the forces out the heel (or toe) >>>>>> BOOM! 

 

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post #12 of 21
3/3/11 at 7:52am

Life is too short to drive on old tires or ski on old bindings!

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post #13 of 21
3/3/11 at 8:32am

This just reinforces the belief some of us have that the Look N77 was the best binding ever made.

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post #14 of 21
3/3/11 at 8:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rio View Post

This just reinforces the belief some of us have that the Look N77 was the best binding ever made.



An argument can be made towards the N77 and Salomon 727...either way who would have thought the French could have designed the best two bindings . Sacre Bleu!

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post #15 of 21
3/3/11 at 9:17am

" I'll give you my N77's when you pry them from my dead cold hands"

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post #16 of 21
3/3/11 at 9:42am

Who wants some NOS Twincam Markers in bright pastel Japanese colors, then?  biggrin.gif

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post #17 of 21
3/3/11 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossi Smash View Post

" I'll give you my N77's when you pry them from my dead cold hands"



Careful what you wish for here.  Someone just might point a plastic heelpiece at you.

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post #18 of 21
3/3/11 at 10:58am

Before there were N77s there were N17s. Back in the day I broke the metal arm of an N17 as I skied thru a dip as I aproached the chairlift mid terminal. I replaced the broken part from my personal parts bin that night and the next day as I skied thru the same dip i broke the other metal arm. Must have been metal fatigue stiking again.

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post #19 of 21
3/3/11 at 11:28am

This thread is in need of some more "rich media"

 

 

These usually don't explode like that except when stepping in to them.  I'm guessing this person noticed a small crack then cranked it all the way up and started the camera rolling. 

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post #20 of 21
3/3/11 at 2:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by crgildart View Post

This thread is in need of some more "rich media"

 

 

These usually don't explode like that except when stepping in to them.  I'm guessing this person noticed a small crack then cranked it all the way up and started the camera rolling. 


The audio on this is hilarious.  It sounds like someone won a giant teddy bear.

 

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post #21 of 21
3/3/11 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by chase View Post

This may be a stupid question, but if the binding were to fail, how hard to you have to be skiing in order to be hurt?

 

Yes, that is a stupid question. You could fall in the lift line and break your neck out or fall backwards off a mountain and walk away.

 

But you already knew that, right?

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