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How is this possible?

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 

So I dusted off my old Metron 9 skis and thought: Hey, let's get them tuned up and maybe have some fun on what once were "the skis that took me to the next level". So $50 later I take them out and holy cow(!) were they ever fast-in a straight line.

 

But.....they...didn't...want to turn. I mean it was like the skis were on railroad tracks. Boy oh boy. Me on a long blue run stopping every couple of 100 feet. Looking like a rank beginner. Almost falling if I got up to speed and tried to turn.

 

My fingers and eyes said the tune looked and felt good-no apparent railing. But it was odd that the edge felt sharper if I ran my finger towards the base rather than away-like my other two pairs feel. I told the guy I wanted the edges 1* and 3*. Any ideas? I can't imagine that he gave me a 3* base and a 1* side bevel. And he did detune the tips and tail.

 

Now mind you they skied OK prior to the tune, but felt like it could use a tune. The base was a bit concave so I have him do a base grind. The guy was proud of his work and seemed  to know what he was doing.

 

Puzzled and ready toss the skis.

 

Thoughts?

post #2 of 12

hanging bur.  Do a search.

post #3 of 12

How were you trying to turn them? Riding the edges, smearing, or twisting them?

post #4 of 12
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post

hanging bur.  Do a search.


Will do.
 

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by ssh View Post

How were you trying to turn them? Riding the edges, smearing, or twisting them?


All of the above. Riding the edges seemed to be the safest, but-golly-gosh-gee whiz; the skis were reluctant. I had my Nordica Afterburners (today, also) and they responed very nicely to my semi-edge riding/smearing style in today's conditions. The M9s felt semi-safe in the very soft stuff but scary in the firm.
 

post #5 of 12

Take a straight edge to the base and check if they are railed....sounds like they are railed...check the whole length but particularily check at the tips and tails...

 

If not...then check if the tips and tails were "detuned".  Typcially you dull the tips and tails anywhere from 1 to 3 inches from the ends....if he forgot to do that, it will make the skis a bit hard to handle as well.

post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post

Take a straight edge to the base and check if they are railed....sounds like they are railed...check the whole length but particularily check at the tips and tails...

 

If not...then check if the tips and tails were "detuned".  Typcially you dull the tips and tails anywhere from 1 to 3 inches from the ends....if he forgot to do that, it will make the skis a bit hard to handle as well.



 Yes. it seems he did, But...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post

hanging bur.  Do a search.


...is it possible that one could have a full length bur. Feels like the sides, not the base has a bur. Maybe I am just imagining it, but it does feel like the side has a full length bur.

 

Call me crazy, but what do I know.
 

post #7 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post


...is it possible that one could have a full length bur. Feels like the sides, not the base has a bur. Maybe I am just imagining it, but it does feel like the side has a full length bur.

 

Yes, it is possible.   Fortunately, one or at most two passes with a freehand gummi can get rid of this.

 

One other thing that can make the skis feel -sort of- like what you describe is a really *deep* structure right next to the edges.   As in medium- to-coarse linear structure (read: visibly linear, as fat as a 0.3mm pencil lead or fatter).     But, I suspect you do not have this.

 

The part where you had the guy grind to get rid of the "concavity" bothers me a little bit, but, never mind.

post #8 of 12
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by comprex View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post


...is it possible that one could have a full length bur. Feels like the sides, not the base has a bur. Maybe I am just imagining it, but it does feel like the side has a full length bur.

 

Yes, it is possible.   Fortunately, one or at most two passes with a freehand gummi can get rid of this.

 

One other thing that can make the skis feel -sort of- like what you describe is a really *deep* structure right next to the edges.   As in medium- to-coarse linear structure (read: visibly linear, as fat as a 0.3mm pencil lead or fatter).     But, I suspect you do not have this.

 

The part where you had the guy grind to get rid of the "concavity" bothers me a little bit, but, never mind.


Hmm......

 

This is getting to be a bit like a mystery novel. The new structure is on the coarse side. And you say you are bothered "a bit' by me having asked the guy to flatten the base. OK, maybe the skis are totally screwed up. My bad. This might be a clear case of "if it ain't broke don't fix it". nonono2.gif Good news is the M9s are old and kinda used up. Being out $50 is no big deal in the scheme of things in the world of skiing

 

I really appreciate all of the input. Truth be told, I am very reluctant to ski the M9s, even after doing everything mentioned here-which I have now done BTW. OK, next I go to the local hill with two pairs of skis. Wish me luck.

 

 


 

post #9 of 12

Good luck!

post #10 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by comprex View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post


...is it possible that one could have a full length bur. Feels like the sides, not the base has a bur. Maybe I am just imagining it, but it does feel like the side has a full length bur.

 

Yes, it is possible.   Fortunately, one or at most two passes with a freehand gummi can get rid of this.

 

One other thing that can make the skis feel -sort of- like what you describe is a really *deep* structure right next to the edges.   As in medium- to-coarse linear structure (read: visibly linear, as fat as a 0.3mm pencil lead or fatter).     But, I suspect you do not have this.

 

The part where you had the guy grind to get rid of the "concavity" bothers me a little bit, but, never mind.


Hmm......

 

This is getting to be a bit like a mystery novel. The new structure is on the coarse side.

 

The road to proceed is fairly clear, to my mind:

 

1.  Use light pass(es) with a gummi to get rid of possible burr (as has been described elsewhere on this site).

 

2.   Go ski.  

 

3. If behaviour persists,  wax with  hard wax (CH6 or harder) and do not brush out after scraping.   If behaviour goes away for the first few or several runs, and then comes back, you know it is the structure.

 

Sound reasonable?

post #11 of 12
Thread Starter 
Quote:

 

The road to proceed is fairly clear, to my mind:

 

1.  Use light pass(es) with a gummi to get rid of possible burr (as has been described elsewhere on this site).

 

2.   Go ski.  

 

3. If behaviour persists,  wax with  hard wax (CH6 or harder) and do not brush out after scraping.   If behaviour goes away for the first few or several runs, and then comes back, you know it is the structure.

 

Sound reasonable?


OK. It appears to be the structure. It is quite coarse. I have never seen stucture that coarse on new skis-or my other two pairs, or my wife's ski. Or on the M9 even when new.

 

So how does one fix the structure? Base grind? If so, said skis are going to the Salvation Army.
 

post #12 of 12

Well, before you re-grind the bases, you could try a bit of a different trick, perfectly feasible with hand tools.

 

It consists of extending  the base bevel of the edges and grinding a bit into the plastic next to the edge.

 

Alpinord on this site had a fairly decent writeup of this; it was also covered in some Atomic tech manuals.     Atomic call it "off-set polishing".

 

atomic2.jpg

 

 

 

Alpinord does something similar here:

 

http://www.epicski.com/forum/thread/69229/reducing-overbevel-diy-style

 

- just ignore the part where he takes it back down to flat.

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