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GS skis are quicker than SL skis on fearly tight GS course

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

At our local club GS race yesterday I skied the first run with my SL skis. I was able to carve every turn cleanly. It did not feel that fast but it felt efficient. The clock however showed little murcy. I lost half a second to a guy I normally win. So I swapped to GS skis (r24m L182cm) and even if it was a struggle from start to finnish I was able to ski half a second quicker.

post #2 of 15

It's pretty hard to tell how clean your tips and tails are when most of the ski is carving cleanly, usually a back to back run will let you know.  It took a run on my old skis to realize that when I was skiing turns slightly over the sidecut of my SCs that I wasn't carving them (math later confirmed it).  Also on gs skis with a greater edge angle you get the same turn radius as you would on the SL skis with the lesser tipping angle, so you can turn harder (more grip with the bigger edge angle) and go faster without slipping out of the groove.

post #3 of 15

it all depends on the course set and how good u are on your gs vs sl skis. I found the same thing the other day and was quite shocked that i was faster on my gs skis, but it was because they are more stable and i wasnt getting launched after every turn. specifically in a gs gate set its nice not to be dealing with redirection of skis mid air.

 

 

post #4 of 15

The longest (and longest radius) ski that you can turn cleanly in a course will be fastest.  Depending on the course set (steepness, gate offset) and the skier's ability,  that might very well be a slalom ski.  I wrote this article on that subject for TopiaRoad.com a few years ago.

 

This year I've alternated using both GS and Slalom skis depending on course sets and have been pretty happy with the results.

post #5 of 15

Given your SL skis are probably 165cm and your GS are 183cm, the GS will obviously be faster.  Your SL are probably about a 15R while your GS are 24R, so they're going to be harder to turn.  If you are able to manage the GS skis, they will of course be faster.

post #6 of 15

What he said.  I only race Masters courses, and while there is some variation (we had a SL last weekend where there were some 13 to 14 meter vertical distance between some of the gates), everything we run, including training, is pretty much set to Masters standards, which are a derivation of the FIS stuff.  My two pairs of SLs are Atomic D2 165s, FIS compliant with a 12.2 radius, or whatever it is.  My two pairs of GSs are Atomic D2 184s, FIS complaint with a 26.2 radius.  Today we ran SL, and our coach set some 9 meter gates at the top.  No way could I get through the course, let alone go fast, on anything except my 165s. Tomorrow we'll run full length, big hill GS with 20 to 22 meter spacing between the gates.  I could get through the course on my 165s, but I'd be overturning and wouldn't have the stability/glide/surface area I need.  I'll use my 184s, thank you...

 

biggrin.gif

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by patmoore View Post

The longest (and longest radius) ski that you can turn cleanly in a course will be fastest.  Depending on the course set (steepness, gate offset) and the skier's ability,  that might very well be a slalom ski.  I wrote this article on that subject for TopiaRoad.com a few years ago.

 

This year I've alternated using both GS and Slalom skis depending on course sets and have been pretty happy with the results.

post #7 of 15

In statistics and science they have a thing called a "Blind Study" where the participant is not aware of whatever is being studied.

 

So:  smile.gif

 

- It's critical that you have no contact or access to the skis prior to starting a run.

 

- Make sure the entire process is recorded on video including any sharpening (the number of strokes must be the same for each ski of course.

 

- Have a trusted friend wax your skis with the appropriate wax for the conditions that may be anticipated for that day.

 

- Have the same trusted friend apply tape or a washable paint to the skis so you can't read which is which.

 

- Have the trusted friend with the assistance of another trusted friend assist you getting into the skis for a run.

 

- Most importantly, have an observer there to make sure the blindfold does not come off before you start the run ensuring you don't know which is which.

post #8 of 15

In the hands of a skilled racer a SL ski should not be faster than a GS ski in a real GS set.

post #9 of 15
Thread Starter 

In one race I took part a few years ago a couple of 25y old x-FIS racers used SL skis on a moderately tight GS course and won by big marginal.

post #10 of 15

It was the skiers ability to read the course and work the ski. The same racers would have been faster on a GS ski. 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post

In one race I took part a few years ago a couple of 25y old x-FIS racers used SL skis on a moderately tight GS course and won by big marginal.

post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 

NECoach, yes they wood have.

post #12 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki View Post


 

- Most importantly, have an observer there to make sure the blindfold does not come off before you start the run ensuring you don't know which is which.



Awesome.  Actually, to be fair, the blindfold shouldn't come off until you cross the finish, right?

post #13 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiRacer55 View Post

  My two pairs of SLs are Atomic D2 165s, FIS compliant with a 12.2 radius, or whatever it is.  My two pairs of GSs are Atomic D2 184s, FIS complaint with a 26.2 radius.   


Isn't the minimum cut 27 meters?
 

post #14 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamt View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiRacer55 View Post

  My two pairs of SLs are Atomic D2 165s, FIS compliant with a 12.2 radius, or whatever it is.  My two pairs of GSs are Atomic D2 184s, FIS complaint with a 26.2 radius.   


Isn't the minimum cut 27 meters?
 


Yes, if you're a man. But then the minimum length is also 185cm. 184@26.2 is a FIS legal women's ski (rule is 180@r>23).

post #15 of 15


What he said.  Actually, for Masters, you can use anything you want, but a women's FIS legal GS works for me...
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawker View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamt View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiRacer55 View Post

  My two pairs of SLs are Atomic D2 165s, FIS compliant with a 12.2 radius, or whatever it is.  My two pairs of GSs are Atomic D2 184s, FIS complaint with a 26.2 radius.   


Isn't the minimum cut 27 meters?
 


Yes, if you're a man. But then the minimum length is also 185cm. 184@26.2 is a FIS legal women's ski (rule is 180@r>23).

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