EpicSki  ›  The Barking Bear Forums  ›  Ski Training Forums  ›  Fitness, Injury, and Recovery  ›  anyone think they have the <absolute best> exercise to prep for skiing?

anyone think they have the <absolute best> exercise to prep for skiing?

#1
Rating: 0
whether it be a core, leg, or whatever exercise does anyone think that one specific exercise they do is the best?

This applies also to anyone thinking they have the best structured set of exercises

Export to Wiki
#2
Rating: 0
I know this is not the answer you're looking for, but my purchase of a skiers edge machine was probably the best thing I did with respect to getting a serious ski related workout....did just about everything else but no better way to work your ski muscles than to ski!
Export to Wiki
#3
Rating: 0
Well, er, skiing is the best prep.  And a couple areas are open now.  If you don't have any real snow nearby and can't travel, you can ski on "black snow" (asphalt) using various ski simulators.  The ones I know and use are Harb Carvers.  Other skiers practice carving on inline skates or other skate-like devices.  The forum search toolbar will show you several threads on all of these options.

The ski simulators with 2 rows of wheels train ski balance while also training all of those muscles that we just use differently in skiing.  Train slalom on these and it will boost your skiing.  You can use inline skating type cones for gates or simply stick pieces of colored duct tape to the road / parking lot surface.

n.b. any training device using rubber wheels on pavement will resist sideways sliding movements because the wheels grip the pavement, so they're not useful for training pivot slips or similar drills.  But they do train carving movements nicely.

------

I have a skiers edge (all mountain w/ extra 3rd belt) and it's a good workout.  Many people consider them pricey.  If you're interested, they discount the prices noticeably at the end of the season, and used ones show up for sale from time to time on various online skiing forums. Iriponsnow's wife has an affiliation with the skiers edge company, so he may be able to tell you more useful info.

finesse + balance + a big grin  skiing
Export to Wiki
#4
Rating: 0
Skiers Edge, P90x and running to build cardio.
"For me skiing has always been about what I feel as opposed to what I think..." Hilary Lindh

"A setback is just a setup for a comeback" Errol Kerr
Export to Wiki
#5
Rating: 0
The other way to get discounted skier edge machines (cuz that's what I did!) is to ask if they have any factory seconds...in my case, my machine had a couple chips in the paint that I have not noticed since...saved me $500!!
Export to Wiki
#6
Rating: 0
grass skiing...
not the best but close when you dont have snow in the summer.
Export to Wiki
#7
Rating: 0
Export to Wiki
#8
Rating: 0
love the hill bounding video. He's got some quick feet.
Most people will need total body strengthening to do that .
For me the single best exercise would be the squat.
Properly done and with all it's variations.
Legs,hips,back,core thru a full ROM.
Back ,front,overhead,tabata,split,bulgarian split,pistol. All variations of sitting and standing (the squat).
Become competant at these and your body will be bullet proof.
Export to Wiki
#9
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowfan View Post

Skiers Edge, P90x and Insanity to build cardio.

Fixed it for ya. 

60 is the new 40
Growing Old is Not For Sissies

Export to Wiki
#10
Rating: 0
The Skiers Edge is the easiest way to get your legs in shape.  1000 turns at max resistance equals a day of skiing.  If you can't afford the machine, jump sideways over a box.  That works, too..  I just replaced the power band on my Skiers Edge after six years...and it looks like it did when it was new.  Very well made. If I had room for weights at home I'd be doing squats, too.
Export to Wiki
#11
Rating: 0
I'm a strength and conditioning consultant (certs include CSCS, NASM-CPT and FMS) at a sports therapy clinic, so my job is to evaluate people and then create custom strength and conditioning programs for them based on their goals, fitness level and most importantly - their personal asymmetries and movement limitations.  I'm also a part-time ski instructor (CSIA-II).

Here's my suggestions for pre-season ski training:
- squats, romanian deadlifts (RDL), pull ups, push ups, planks, side planks, single-leg shoulder elevated hip lifts
- for the leg stuff, start at 3x10 reps but then go to 4x6.
- if you have any back issues, think about split squats and single-leg squats instead of bilateral ones.
- do interval training instead of steady-state.  Running for 30+ minutes at the same speed might feel good but it doesn't translate well to skiing, but 15 minutes of 30 second hard then 60s easy does.    
- once you have a strength base (2-3 weeks is probably enough), think about adding low-level plyometrics.  lower-body stuff should be about jumping onto a box, and single leg hops where you stick the landing; upper body stuff can be any variety of medicine ball throws (fast is more important than heavy). 
- get yourself a good dynamic warmup that addresses your personal imbalances.  If you can find a good trainer who is functional movement screen (FMS) certified to help you figure this out, that is ideal.  If not, think about a warmup that works on increasing your ankle, hip and thoracic spine mobility, and helps you to activate your glutes and core.
- buy a foam roller and use it regularly for pretty much your entire body.

Elsbeth

www.elsbethvaino.com

www.elsbethvaino.com

Export to Wiki
#12
Rating: 0


Quote:Originally Posted by BillA View Post

Skiers Edge, P90x and Insanity to build cardio



Skiers Edge, P90x and Running In sanity to build cardio

There, fixed it for me!

"For me skiing has always been about what I feel as opposed to what I think..." Hilary Lindh

"A setback is just a setup for a comeback" Errol Kerr
Export to Wiki
#13
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by evaino View Post

I'm a strength and conditioning consultant (certs include CSCS, NASM-CPT and FMS) at a sports therapy clinic, so my job is to evaluate people and then create custom strength and conditioning programs for them based on their goals, fitness level and most importantly - their personal asymmetries and movement limitations.  I'm also a part-time ski instructor (CSIA-II).

Here's my suggestions for pre-season ski training:
- squats, romanian deadlifts (RDL), pull ups, push ups, planks, side planks, single-leg shoulder elevated hip lifts
- for the leg stuff, start at 3x10 reps but then go to 4x6.
- if you have any back issues, think about split squats and single-leg squats instead of bilateral ones.
- do interval training instead of steady-state.  Running for 30+ minutes at the same speed might feel good but it doesn't translate well to skiing, but 15 minutes of 30 second hard then 60s easy does.    
- once you have a strength base (2-3 weeks is probably enough), think about adding low-level plyometrics.  lower-body stuff should be about jumping onto a box, and single leg hops where you stick the landing; upper body stuff can be any variety of medicine ball throws (fast is more important than heavy). 
- get yourself a good dynamic warmup that addresses your personal imbalances.  If you can find a good trainer who is functional movement screen (FMS) certified to help you figure this out, that is ideal.  If not, think about a warmup that works on increasing your ankle, hip and thoracic spine mobility, and helps you to activate your glutes and core.
- buy a foam roller and use it regularly for pretty much your entire body.

Elsbeth

www.elsbethvaino.com
 


"For me skiing has always been about what I feel as opposed to what I think..." Hilary Lindh

"A setback is just a setup for a comeback" Errol Kerr
Export to Wiki
#14
Rating: 0

Damn, that is fast. I would probably snap my shins attempting that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NordtheBarbarian View Post

hill bounding



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWBkCDdgj2E&feature=related


Export to Wiki
#15
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by evaino View Post

Elsbeth

www.elsbethvaino.com

 

I like what you are suggesting.

It sounds like Crossfit in many ways.  The benefit of Crossfit is the schedule, the people you train with, the coaching and the program.
Not everyone can join a Crossfit but it really is amazing.

I have posted many times in fitness threads and always talk about Crossfit, either directly or indirectly.  I came into Crossfit last October and thought I was in pretty good shape and knowledgeable about training.  Now after a year of very regular attendance and serious dedication, the season is about to begin.  I wonder if I am actually going to see a benefit.  15 lbs lighter will help.  I know I am much stronger and that I have experience high intensity workouts - never before experienced.  But will it transfer to skiing?  Will I still need to stop every 100 yards on steep terrain?

But without a doubt, joining Crossfit will give you very fast results.  If you see me sucking wind on the side of the trail, however, it should not be a reflection on Crossfit.
Export to Wiki
#16
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Jones View Post




I like what you are suggesting.

It sounds like Crossfit in many ways.  The benefit of Crossfit is the schedule, the people you train with, the coaching and the program.
Not everyone can join a Crossfit but it really is amazing.

I have posted many times in fitness threads and always talk about Crossfit, either directly or indirectly.  I came into Crossfit last October and thought I was in pretty good shape and knowledgeable about training.  Now after a year of very regular attendance and serious dedication, the season is about to begin.  I wonder if I am actually going to see a benefit.  15 lbs lighter will help.  I know I am much stronger and that I have experience high intensity workouts - never before experienced.  But will it transfer to skiing?  Will I still need to stop every 100 yards on steep terrain?

But without a doubt, joining Crossfit will give you very fast results.  If you see me sucking wind on the side of the trail, however, it should not be a reflection on Crossfit.

Hey Paul,

Glad you are enjoying Crossfit.  There are definitely some good things about Crossfit.  Particularly the schedule benefits and for the most part the exercise selection is pretty good.  However I am not really a fan of Crossfit for three key reasons:  

- I feel the emphasis on working to failure instead of working to technical failure is risky. You can really hurt yourself hauling heavy metal if you keep going beyond your ability to maintain good form.
- I'm not a fan of seeing things like sets of 25 or 100.  While this is great as a mental toughness exercise, when you're doing that many reps, you're not really working strength, you're working endurance.  I'm guessing when doing sets of 100, it will take so long that it's aerobic - not even anaerobic, meaning the translation to skiing isn't great.    
- there seems to be no emphasis on warmup and corrective exercises.  If you are active and over 25, odds are you have developed some nagging injuries and probably a host of muscle imbalances.  Without addressing these, we slowly become stiffer and more imbalanced, and this turns into pain, injury and worst of all: crappy turns! :)  

I think if you keep these thoughts in mind, you can do really well with crossfit - just be careful.

Elsbeth

www.elsbethvaino.com

www.elsbethvaino.com

Export to Wiki
#17
Rating: 0
Paul,no worries your gonna eat it up this season.
Stronger ,lighter,way more mobile.

Elsbeth
I don't think you fully understand CrossFit.
Any CF affiliate worth its salt will put thier client thru a thorough warm-up including hip,back and shoulder mobility drills. Alot of those imbalances you speak of can be corrected by just restoring the bodys naturual ROM. The difference in people in just 1 month is remarkable.
 As far as failure vs.tech failure.When you get deep into workout I've found that technique actualy improves .You've got nothing left but form to complete your reps.
 Most of are efforts will be way shorter than that 100 rep killer Paul mentioned .
Shorter more intense met-cons between 6-10 mins. Also most of us will address strength before our WOD .The WOD insn't always about strength it's about increasing work capacity.

"CrossFit is not dangerous,
Bad coaching is dangerous,poor movement is dangerous,Ego is dangerous.
CrossFit ,properly scaled to the individual is the safest and most efficient program available"
Export to Wiki
#18
Rating: 0
Lots of ski racers are focussing more on aerobic conditioning, there's nothing wrong with high reps for skiing. 

In terms of transfer of any general fitness to skiing, skiing's a movement sport, therefore SharpEdge's post recommending very ski-specific exercises.  You have both different stresses and different motor patterns to get in synch -- so the first day can still have you sucking wind if you come in in great shape from a general fitness perspective.  If you have technique issues you can still get really sore calves the first day out, etc. too.  You should find your recovery much faster though. 
Export to Wiki
#19
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by evaino View Post




Hey Paul,

I'm not a fan of seeing things like sets of 25 or 100.  While this is great as a mental toughness exercise, when you're doing that many reps, you're not really working strength, you're working endurance.  I'm guessing when doing sets of 100, it will take so long that it's aerobic - not even anaerobic, meaning the translation to skiing isn't great. 
   
- there seems to be no emphasis on warm-up and corrective exercises. 

I think if you keep these thoughts in mind, you can do really well with crossfit - just be careful.

Elsbeth

www.elsbethvaino.com
 
We have an extensive warm-up prior to every WOD.  We tend to do a Strength bias prior to the WOD.  An example would be:  3x3 of front squats - 90% of max (yesterday's)  or 3x4 of dead lifts at 90% (day before).  We work up to our working weight with 3 coaches and a room full of experienced Crossfiters.  I often wonder what I would be doing on my own at the Y.  Everyday is different.

Our Sunday WODs tend to be crushing and long.  I agree with you about a 40 min full on session not being strength oriented.  Is it aerobic or anaerobic - I don't know?  I had substantial muscle soreness on Monday.  During the WOD I felt that it was anaerobic - but I don't really know.  There were many 15-20 second rests especially as I faded late in the WOD.  The training effect seemed substantial on this rare Crossfit WOD of 5 elements x 100.  This would not be an effective way to train on a regular basis, but for me, speaking as a slacker, it was awesome.  I'm 55 years old and all I can say -"I did it" - and I am lucky to be able to experience workout like that.

As to working strength v endurance, so what.  Is there any harm in using a 5 k as a WOD.  We do it (I try not to).

What would you recommend as an alternative to Crossfit.  I could go back to the Y and potentially hurt myself (or others). I could get with a personal trainer who's knowledge and experience are unknown.  (many of the people that I know who use personal trainers, and I know many, are in weak programs, experience scheduling problems,and work one on one - without a group)

I do not want to suggest that Crossfit is perfect, but AlbanyCrossfit is a quality operation.  There is on going certifications that are open to and utilized by coaches and members a like.  I think it would be tough to find a better bang for the buck and get in shape quickly.

bz 


Export to Wiki
#20
Rating: 0
Did someone mention core strength?

http://www.qajaqusa.org/Technique/ropegymnastics.htm

Now on Mondays.

Export to Wiki
#21
Rating: 0
Paul ,I saw your pic on ACF's blog.
Export to Wiki
#22
Rating: 0

I think that's what EVIANO was referring to.  Looks like someone is gonna get hurt

Here's a better one  http://www.albanycrossfit.com/photos/november_2009/dsc_4583.html 
 

Export to Wiki
#23
Rating: 0
First off, thanks Elsbeth. Great post and great web site. There's a lot of good material there.

I'm not a certified trainer, like Elsbeth, but I do read a lot and have trained for skiing for a long time. I don't disagree with anything she says, but I would like to elaborate on it a bit and hopefully get a reaction from Elsbeth.

Questions first, Answers second

One thing is that I would back up a bit and say that I think the right answer starts with more questions:

1. What kind of skiing do you do? Obviously, what you need for skate skiing is not the same as what you need for alpine, and there are some specific exercises you might want if tele is your primary sport, but even what you need for alpine touring is still somewhat different than what you need for alpine resort skiing. This determines a bit the balance between power and endurance in your workouts.

2. What are your goals? Performance? Injury prevention? Ski all day or improve your race times? These are not necessarily antagonistic goals, but they do call for different focus.

3. What's your current fitness state? I spend my summers running fairly long distances (commonly 15-20 miles) on hilly trails at altitude (I live in Yosemite). That's in addition to rock climbing and backpacking. So working endurance in the runup to ski season is counter-productive for alpine skiing. And since hills skate skiing usually push me into the lactate threshold zone, even for that activity I would second Elsbeth's point about intervals versus steady state. Even the most steady state forms of skiing tend to push my lactate threshhold more than trail running. But if you're sport is skate skiing or backcountry and you've gotten out of shape during the summer, you'll need to start laying down an endurance base before the snow flies.

Meanwhile if you have that base, long distance running generally is detrimental to building power, so for alpine ski performance, I would want to move to more power-oriented exercises.

The Core of the Matter
First, though, for recreational skiing, I would want above all to make sure I had a strong core. Strong legs will do nothing to prevent an ACL injury (generally speaking. My old neighbor, Bob Johnson, ran the longest running ski injury study in North America and he noted that the highest injury rates are among top racers who, by the way, have the strongest legs).

A strong core can, however, prevent back problems caused or exacerbated by skiing - lots of bumps and gates will tend to give you very strong back and quads, but not necessarily strengthen the antagonistic muscles essential for a long-term healthy back. I learned that the hard way.

So that means planks, side planks, spiders, TVA strengthening. To Elsbeth's list, I would add static back extensions (either on a Roman chair or on a stability ball with feet under the sofa or dumbell rack). Why? Because, speaking of a Swedish study, Owen Anderson says
Quote:
The main finding in this study, which received the prestigious 1983 Volvo Award in Clinical Science, was that good isometric endurance, not strength, of the back muscles (in other words, an ability of the low-back muscles to maintain moderate levels of force for prolonged periods of time without significant fatigue) was the best apparent preventer of low-back trouble in men and women

Source:http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/archive/low-back-pain-exercises.html

Owen's article is a great read in general and if you have limited time, read that instead of the rest of my blathering. My takeaway has always been that I should be able to hold a back extension for 2 minutes (the study says that at 58 seconds your risk of injury becomes quite low).

Power Baby!

So, if you've had a good summer and laid a good endurance base and you are good about keeping up on your core exercises, which you should do year round for general help, we get to more alpine-specific exercises to build POWER!

If I had to pick one exercise for skiing for recreational skiers, assuming a healthy back and a base level of fitness, it would hands down be the power clean - I know the Crossfit folks like that one too. Power cleans will work the whole posterior chain, from your calves to your trapezius and help build explosive force in the legs. The posterior chain is important for strengthening all those muscles that fire hard when you get off balance in the bumps and need to recover. Meanwhile, research on vertical jump ability has shown that of all weightlifting exercises (compared to deadlifts, squats, etc), power clean performance correlates best to vertical jump performance and vertical jump performance is, again, a pretty decent proxy for the kind of leg power you need to ski hard.

The downside to power cleans is that you must have good form to avoid injury and a thorough warmup is essential.

For me, second to power cleans are deadlifts. A lot of the same benefits.

Other favorites that target the legs are front squats and single-leg squats. I see from Elsbeth's website that she's also a fan of Mike Boyle and Grey Cook, two awesome strength and conditioning coaches. They both think that back squats have a relative high risk/reward ratio compared to single-leg squats and front squats.

Finally, as Elsbeth said, once you've got a base, add in some plyometrics. For explosive leg strength, plyometrics have to be part of the equation. I do depth jumps, where you jump from a box and rebound as hard as you can. This is a "quality" not quantity exercise. You want to measure rebound (by touching a point on the wall for example) and stop as soon as you have a decrease in performance. Also, I like "feather jumps" where you try to land as softly as possible, focussing on the ability to control the absoprtion.

For building leg power, lactate threshold "power-endurance" and coordination, I do "shuffle jumps". Basically drop a glove on the ground. Bend down and touch it with your right hand and then spring as hard as you can to the left. Bring your right foot TO but NOT PAST the left foot and spring again. Take four bounds left, drop the other glove and now go back. See if you can do 90 seconds of bounding between the two gloves, always trying to hit the target gloves you dropped on the first rep. Cycle through that in intervals until you feel like you're going to throw up. Just kidding. Sort of.

I used to do a lot of one-legged jump rope as a warm up and cool down back when I was sitll racing (1976-1981) and just the other day, I tried it again. Bloody hell that's hard. I used to do sets of 100. I'm down to sets of 20! Still, I'd forgotten how fun that is.

And finally a couple of comments on two other exercises she mentioned.

Medecine ball workouts. Awesome! I like to find a big boulder or possible a rough stone wall and use that to throw against. It's easier than finding a partner and the rough surface will bounce the ball in unpredictable ways, which I think is great for reaction and working more variety. Also, as a killer core exercise, hold the ball between your feet and jump in the air and try to toss a 10-pound ball over a park bench or, for quicker reps, onto a park bench so it gets returned to you. Another fun one. The first time my wife and I did this, we were having so much fun trying to beat our previous "throws" that we forgot we were exercise. Could barely walk the next day.

A last really good one is the paper bag game. With group of friends, you put a paper bag on the floor. In turn, everyone stands on one leg, bends over and picks up the bag in their mouth. Then you pull out the scissors and cut a couple inches off and go round again. Continue until you're either out of participants or out of bag. As you get low, this is a great leg and balance exercise and a fun thing to do at a party. I hadn't done it in years until last weekend and I still managed to snag the bag as low as 1 inch. In addition to the leg strengthening and balance training, I was amazed at how much it opened up my hips and how good my whole pelvis area felt afterwards.

Whew! That was long. I hope it helps someone ski hard this year!

Tom
http://ultraskier.com


 


Export to Wiki
#24
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by TomL View Post

If I had to pick one exercise for skiing for recreational skiers, assuming a healthy back and a base level of fitness, it would hands down be the power clean - Power cleans will work the whole posterior chain, from your calves to your trapezius and help build explosive force in the legs. 

For me, second to power cleans are deadlifts. A lot of the same benefits.

Other favorites that target the legs are front squats and single-leg squats. I see from Elsbeth's website that she's also a fan of Mike Boyle and Grey Cook, two awesome strength and conditioning coaches. They both think that back squats have a relative high risk/reward ratio compared to single-leg squats and front squats.


 

Cleans, I agree.  Deadlifts I have found to be core.  Deadlift is posterior chain.  They have helped my back as nothing else could.

I'd say Cleans, Deadlifts, front squats, back squats, overhead squats and thrusters all bring a lot to a skier's conditioning. They all affect core.  It is true that injury is a concern with back squats, but that is true for all squats and especially pistols.  Don't get hurt - that's the name of the game.

I like core exercises that rely on other muscles, such as weighted pull-ups.  Say 3x3 pull up with 90 lbs between legs.  Engages the entire torso.

Tom, great suggestions.  You run a lot.  I need to at least run some.
Export to Wiki
#25
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Jones View Post

What would you recommend as an alternative to Crossfit.  I could go back to the Y and potentially hurt myself (or others). I could get with a personal trainer who's knowledge and experience are unknown.  (many of the people that I know who use personal trainers, and I know many, are in weak programs, experience scheduling problems,and work one on one - without a group)
 

I suggest hiring a competent trainer like me.

You raise a good point though - there are lots of terrible trainers and it's hard to know who's a good one.  And unfortunately a bad one can be both ineffective and even dangerous.  

I may be painting all crossfit with the internet WOD brush.  That and there are some crossfit gyms that are a little insane.  I recall seeing an article about a crossfit gym where people had rabdo man t-shirts.  That's not cool.  I have coached my city's junior ultimate team for the past 2 years - 21 kids between 15 and 18.  In two seasons with me training them, we have had only 1 injury and it was a contact injury, and nationals our kids were strong, fast and could keep going and going.  Compare that with the men's team in town who train with the local crossfit guy - they had over 25% of their team injured for a good part of the season!  And yet they all think this guy is awesome! 

That said, I know you could easily find many equally awful stories about non-crossfit trainers, so bottom line - find someone good. And if you're getting the performance you want and are not bogged down by injuries, then what you're doing is working.  But if you see your physical therapist so often that you have become buddies, then you should probably re-evaluate how you are working out.  

Elsbeth
Edited by evaino - 11/5/09 at 7:11pm

www.elsbethvaino.com

Export to Wiki
#26
Rating: 0
 Tom - nice post!  

Absolutely - skate ski or classic cross-country is much different from alpine. In fact aerobic vs anaerobic, so would have a completely different program. Although may have some elements in common.

Only real comment I would say is that remember that depth jumps are a very advanced plyometric. Great exercise, but should only be done once there is a significant base of strength and after having done a few rounds of lower impact plyos. Jumping onto a box is where people should start - you still get the great explosive benefits, but you have gravity helping to reduce the impact instead of accelerating it.  Lateral and medial hops are amazing plyos for skiing - first few weeks they should be done by "sticking the landing" in between hops and then progress to continuous ones.  Plyos are also best done with low reps - 100 foot contacts per week is a good goal.  Remember that power is about speed and strength, so to get maximal benefit you need to be fresh - thus not too many of them and with adequate rest in between sets.

Cleans are great too - as long as they are done well.  I really like single arm db snatches too.  

Definitely agree about the back extension endurance - just be careful that it's extension and not hyperextension.  And be doubly careful if you've ever had spondylolysthesis (facet fracture).  Also think about side planks for endurance.  There is evidence linking higher risk of sports hernia injuries among hockey players who can't hold a side plank for 70s.  Based on movement, I would suggest that skiers would be wise to aim for similar side plank endurance.

Elsbeth


 
 

www.elsbethvaino.com

Export to Wiki
#27
Rating: 0


Quote:
Originally Posted by evaino View Post




I suggest hiring a competent trainer like me.

 

Good post.  But from what I can see, good trainers are few and far between.  Expensive too.

I would never try to second guess your program, it sounds great.  But the Crossfit program is up and running all over the world producing great results.  I don't know about injury stats and Crossfit.  We have not had a problem as far as I am aware.  Crossfit works without a doubt.

I should try the personal trainer route to compare.
Export to Wiki
#28
Rating: 0
GPP
general physical preparedness
train them all ,specialize in nothing.
Export to Wiki
#29
Rating: 0
>> depth jumps are a very advanced plyometric.

Roger that.

Also, a lot of people do these from much too high. The research I've read says that at 30cm (12") you get the vast majority of the benefit, with a much lower risk of injury than jumping from 60cm or, as I see in YouTube videos, 1m and more. That's just stupid for most people. Certainly for a 46-year-old like me it is.

>>100 foot contacts per week is a good goal

I read an article about this too. I should dig it up. They studied different plyo programs. The takeaway I had was that it really isn't worth it to do more than 2 sessions per week and that even Division I college volleyball players didn't benefit from more than 100 jumps (I think) per session. Of course, for most of us that number would be much lower 'cause we're neither that young nor that fit. I'm vaguely remembering those numbers, but the paper is kicking around if anyone's curious. I can dig it up and give the citation and the precise numbers.

Again, not saying my advice is great. I just enjoy exercise and reading scientific papers. I'm not a certified trainer.

>>Jumping onto a box

Another great one. This can be as easy or advanced as you want by changing the height of the box and the amount of weight you hold in your hands.

>> think about side planks for endurance.

If I didnt' mention them, I meant to. I'm weak in side planks. I find 1 minute fairly hard, whereas I'll go as much as three minutes on a good day on planks.

Your 70 second number makes me think I should build to 2 minutes on those (I really don't like hurting my back), but I don't think I could do 2 mins right now. Something I need to work on.

I'm fairly new to EpicSki and mostly I've been a lurker rather than a poster, but this has been a great discussion!

Thanks to everyone who contributed so far.
Export to Wiki
#30
Rating: 0
Paul....

>>Say 3x3 pull up with 90 lbs between legs

That's hard core. I used to be able to do 10 with 70 lbs (so 50% bodyweight). Now I can barely do 10 :-( 

It's pathetic. I think if I tried pullups with 90lbs now my arms would pull out of my sockets!
Export to Wiki