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Bumps in base from bindings

#1
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10/25/09 at 8:19am
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I picked up a pair of 138 Rossi Phantoms over the summer for my son.  Then I went down to my favorite local shop and bought a pair of Rossi binding and had them mounted to them.  Yesterday, I was was getting ready to lay down layers apon layers of wax on them, I noticed two bumps on each ski right underneath the rear screws.  The base material wasn't broken, but ohh so close. 

I packed them up along with his boots and headed down to the shop.  The main tech that I usually deal with wasnt there, so I showed them to one of the other techs.  He looked at them and said "Ohh thats not good".  I was in good spirits and said no isnt wasn't good.  He then asked if they did the work and I replied "Yea..that's why I'm here."  He said they would take care of them and fix them, but the main tech would do it next week. 

My questions after searching out the issue on here are...

1.  Can they be fixed?
2.  Is it a good fix or is the integrity of the ski comprimised.
3.  How are the dimples on the bases handled??

I don't have a problem with the shop at all.  I have faith they will deal with the problem and fix it to my satisfaction.  But what should satifiy me when I talk to the main tech??

Thanks

Bill
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#2
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10/25/09 at 8:26am
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They cannot be fixed.

The right thing is for the shop to mount a new set of skis for you
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#3
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10/25/09 at 8:48am
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Why cant they be fixed???

Bill
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#4
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10/25/09 at 9:12am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_in_PDX View Post

Why cant they be fixed???

Bill
the screws were drilled too far and the material is pushing down towards the base.

Perhaps an industry expert will correct me, but my wife had this happen with a pair of skis and that was what we were told, and the shop replaced it all for us on their buck

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#5
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10/25/09 at 10:09am
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They can easily be fixed, you will never know the difference and will never have a problem... the question is should they be fixed or should you get a new pair?

That's a tough question because the skis were not purchased at the shop but the bindings were. The shop will have to give you a ski, so they lose. On the other hand, they didn't check screw length before mounting the skis and they compounded the mistake by not inspecting their work. They sort of owe you a perfect pair of skis, you are due that, but if you let them repair the ski (simple fix*) they will probably treat you like royalty any time you need anything else from them. Choice is up to you.


* the fix will be removing the heel, grinding down the screws, gently heating the base to relax the p-tex and get it flat then re-mounting the heel.
skiershop.com
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#6
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10/25/09 at 10:14am
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^What Whiteroom said.  


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#7
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10/25/09 at 10:26am
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I pretty much thought they could be fixed fairly easily.  Now regarding should they...hmmmmm...we will see what they plan to do.  Keep in mind I just dropped over 2 grand at their store over the last 6 months or so on new gear.  Am I a valued customer??  I would hope so.  Perhaps a percentage off my next purchase??  A free bar of wax won't cut it. 

Does make one wonder why they didnt catch the mistake.  And does this happen often...only to be caught and fixed with the customer unaware. 

They are my sons skis.  I am hoping he can get two years out of them before he outgrows them.  I have to keep that in mind when I talk to them.  But they were perfect when I first handed them over and I am abit of a gear nut.  Thats why him and I were getting ready to hot scrape and wax them.  Teaching him now how to take care of his gear now so hopefully he can take care of mine in a few more years.

Bill



 

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#8
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10/25/09 at 10:41am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_in_PDX View Post

I pretty much thought they could be fixed fairly easily.  Now regarding should they...hmmmmm...we will see what they plan to do.  Keep in mind I just dropped over 2 grand at their store over the last 6 months or so on new gear.  Am I a valued customer??  I would hope so.  Perhaps a percentage off my next purchase??  A free bar of wax won't cut it. 
 


A pair of new current skis at their cost doesn't seem too much to ask and would be more than a generous gesture on your part.  That should make you gold in their eyes, which could give you years of good will there.  
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#9
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10/25/09 at 11:01am
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I'd agree with Bill Lee, except I'd be a bit more 'demanding'... and I'm always on the 'shop side' in these instances. If you want new skis, and I feel you are due that, then you shouldn't have to pay anything. not shop cost, not a second mounting fee-- nothing. You brought in a new ski that you paid for, you deserve a new ski, you shouldn't have to pay anything. It's how the transaction should have taken place in the first place.

The reality is this is not uncommon, with smaller kids skis the binding screws are going into a very, very thin area. Sometimes the screws provided (hell, almost always on small skis with 'tweener' bindings) need to be ground down so they don't dimple the base, it is a true nightmare at times. It's like ski makers don't understand that a binding will need to be mounted...

So it happens, if you let them handle the repair you won't notice it, ever. It will not effect the ski performance or the life-span of the ski. It shouldn't have happened but it did. It can easily be fixed, but it shouldn't have to be... you need to decide if you want to demand a new ski or if you want to be 'the nice guy' and hope you get more back (eventually) than you will with a 'newer' new kids ski.

I, personally, would let the shop fix the ski and expect a hook-up on some adult gear or service down the road... but I'm not you, and you need to live with your choice and feel comfortable with it.
skiershop.com
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#10
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10/25/09 at 11:05am
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I'm not so sure, just thinking of the mechanics of the bumps. I've worked with the problem before on my own skis. If the hole was pre-drilled exactly to the P-tex, you could remove the screw, heat the ptex, tap on the bump, flat file the base and all good. But if the screw that was put into the hole initially pushed core material into the space between the core and the base, no amount of pounding or warming is going to return the ptex to the position flush with the core. And that has been my experience every time. I had to flat file the base in that area and in the back of my mind I knew that there was this debris wedging the base away from the core. bugged me,gear nut also, but I don't know that it was a problem. I saw this happen to a guys new Mantras at a shop and couldn't resist listening to the discussion that followed
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#11
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10/25/09 at 11:07am
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There are probably 50,000 or more pairs of skis in use today where the techs didn't grind down the screws enough the first time but fixed the problem before the skis left the store.  I've seen several where they didn't fix them too.  Only a VERY competitive racer or people that grind their skis way more than needed might notice a repair, assuming they show little circles at a later date.  But, for kids' skis, that will likely be outgrown before they are close to worn down or placed under major stress, I would probably let the shop slide with fixing them and not replacing them.

FWIW, some folks also shoot a drop of epoxy down in the hole when replacing the newly ground down screws, then clamp the base to the ski while the glue dries.

Smell that?  Winter's coming!
 

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#12
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10/25/09 at 11:12am
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I'm not going to push for them to replace the skis..as long as I feel its been fixed correctly.  But I will expect the hook up as well then next few times I go in and drop some bucks.  And I will make sure I relay that to them.

I would think the epoxy would be a must.

Bill
 
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#13
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10/25/09 at 1:04pm
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Thanks for the clarification - interesting the info we received from  the shop replaced my wife's skis, without us even requesting a replacement.

Non-expert here humbly bowing out.......
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