Beginners tip bible - share yours

 

I dont really give this much thought (since I am a tuning and waxing fanatic), but now that you mention this I recall a time before I knew better and my skis were rarely waxed, and I do remember at least once that I put my ski down onto the snow and the bases had ice frozen over them, though it did easily enough slide right off.

Edited by Richie-Rich - Fri, 06 Feb 09 04:13:04 GMT

 

Roger that.  Just went back and re-read, and got it this time.

Recently starting nosing around Epic a bit more again and discovered my little pet here lying dormant....no activity and completely forgotten.

The original intent was to have our skilled and knowledgeable folks chime in with free tips and help for our newbie visitors. Largely, it did not happen tho there was some gold in here given up by members.

Disappointing.

My thoughts were if a beginner took the time to hunt down our forum they were deserving of receiving some free goodies to make their new quest to understand our sport a little easier.   Further, newbies are often the most passionate of skiers, discovering things other more skilled and experienced skiers have forgotten and bringing new enthusiasm to the sport and thus (I had hoped)to our forum by sharing their journeys along skiing's pathway to excellence and understanding with us as active contributors.

- - -

So, once again I'll give my little pet a bumperoo.

I hope my beginner friends took the time to view the fantastic free visuals offered up here via the links to the Canadian and Italian demo team videos. Tens of thousands of dollars of free lessons there, freebees of the highest magnitude. No flaming or arguing over tipping vs steering or big toe vs little toe, just pure high level images to learn from and emulate.....images which demonstrate the pathway of learning progression....along the lines of how ATS Centerline used to. Clear, no jargon....just click on the link and enjoy. Of course there may be jargon on www.amsao.it but my Italian is not so good.

- - -

Enuff, here is my tip for today, of course sticking with my theme of focusing on visual learning. 

Just received my latest issue of Ski Magazine(wow is it thin now, no advertising at all) and viewed a fantastic ski technique article by Mike Rogan.

Mike explains with some fantastic images how important it is to keep the upper body/ shoulders square to the fall line, maintaining the upper body as a core while the legs move in the direction of the turn below. Unlike many articles I have seen which confuse the beginner with ego driven jargon this one is crystal clear. Never met Mike Rogan but I bet he is a real good guy too.

Not a free tip of course, you might have to buy the magazine but the visuals are so clear even the most novice skier should be able to benefit.

- - -

Bump for more free tips?

 This is really helpful, thanks everyone!

By the way, from a beginner's perspective, the advice about clothing/what to wear/how to stay dry are definitely appreciated. Clothing is one of the more confusing things when you're just starting.

Beginners Tips.o

1. As a Beginner, if you fall in love with skiing from the start.  Buy your clothing and look for quality if you can afford.  There are some great underclothes available now, wicking and warmth are pluses.  As a Beginner Do Not wear a cotton T Shirt under the new wicking undergarments.

2.  Beginner tip (KISS principle).  Don't look down at your ski's, even when you are learning the lst day, 2nd day or ever.   By looking down at your ski's you are inadvertently causing yourself to get stiff, tighten your muscles and tense up.  All 3 of these reactions are not inducive to keep yourself as loose and relaxed as possible.  Look out in front of yourself, where you are going to go, not where you are (because that is where you were) and that does you no good at all.

If you are new to Epic and a beginner, go to the Beginners Zone and go back through the pages and you will find some good and interresting posts that were put there for your benefit when the Beginers Forum was started.

 

We were all Beginners once and can appreciate your quest.

1. Propely fitting boots:  Get a footbed. A good generic one or a custom one.  This is the place to start. Even before buying a boot. Put it in your rentals if you are renting then when purchasing a boot try it on with the footbed. There are other fitting tips but this is #1.
2. Learn how to use your pole straps properly.  Or don't use them.
3. Take them off every time you are on a chair.  Don't get on a chair with anyone who does not take theirs off.  They are an accident waiting to happen.
4. Let the snowboarders ride the chair together.  When they hop off they often turn their boards sideways and can clip your tails and slam you go!
5. Buckle your boots. I never use the word tight when telling customers how a boot should fit.

Loose is not good because it is potentially dangerous.  Every time I've had a customer who said they fell and the binding did not release I had them buckle their boots as they did that day and not one had them on snugly.  I tell customers there are three words when boot fitting (beyond footbed), loose, snug, and tight.  Two of them are bad.  TIGHT HURTS.  That tells your brain that something is wrong.  SNUG or very snug should do it.  Wear them for several minutes when trying them on. 

Try on boots with a very thin sock. 
6.  If a cohort falls on the downhlll side of the slope, stand high to them and hold up your pole so that oncoming skiers will see you ahead sooner as opposed to "too later!"
7.  If you are involved in a collision, even if there is no injury, report it to ski patrol.  EVERY TIME, Ski hill incidents need to be documented.  The folks who operate them need to have better and accurate info regarding the safety on the hills which is not adequate.  I've heard of many incidents where an injury was not recognized until later on that day and there is no recourse because the offender took off yelling, "sorry dude!"
8.  Enter into your cell phone, the number of the SKI PATROL.  This way if there is an injury you won't have to call 911 and tell them you are a skier and have them connect you... TIME IS WASTING.  This could save a life.
9. Know the code.  Don't know it?  Ask when you buy a ticket.
10.  Take a lesson.
11.  Don't take a lesson from your boyfriend who has been skiing since age two and would otherwise tell you "it is easy! Follow me!"
12.  Get a helmet.
13. Get a mouthguard too.
14.  Zip up your coat. 
15.  Don't go to a swap to buy your equipment or on some internet list.  I'm amazed how much junk is sold to the naive in incorrect sizing (read dangerous) in boots or skis.  And this is often to raise money for ski patrols.  They should not want to up their business.
16.  If a snowboarder, get wrist guards.  Save yourself some grief.  Broken wrists are the most common of injuries on the ski hill.
17.  In children's boots, add an arch pad in lieu of a relatively expensive footbed to secure the comfort and control of the boot.  Even children should have this added support.
18.  Don't wear two pairs of socks. 
19.  Stay hydrated and nourished.
20.  Take a lesson. You might learn something.

EJL

Oh yes,
When skiing "square to the fall line" how is that done when skiing up hill?
EJL

Beginners.   Have fun and enjoy yourself.  Disregard almost all of the above 20 items.   My god this is a fun sport not a list of do and don't. Please don't think you have to do all this crap, yes if you can take a lesson but you don't have to register with the ski patrol, eek what a dumb idea.

For our visual learner newbies exciting news!

CSIA have updated their demo team videos

Unlike the Italians you can leave the sound on for some verbal ques and cool rock music.

http://www.snowproab.com/skipro/course_materials.htm

- - - -

Newbies ignore the comments below:

I thought about posting this exciting  news in the technique forum but I did not want to be responsible for starting a flame war about the Canadian tendency to hop.....

even though I like hopping and tend to hop a bit myself

- - - -

Beginner helper hat back on:

For those of you newbies who don't want to hunt back to post one here are the Italians again.....not updated but still my personal fav....

http://www.amsao.it/main.php?curr_liv=0&curr_id=47&prec_liv=0&prec_id=0〈=it&tip=1

- - - -

Keep any sarcasm relegated to the technique forums please. I don't really care if you think the Italians have too much A frame and look like gapers in their outfits.....this is for the newbies.




This after all is my thread and I make the

Of course, all should feel free and welcome to compare and contrast skiing styles between the two schools in the technique forum.

Still looking for the free PSIA videos to post......anyone have any post em up for the benefit of our newbie friends.....or even better links to ESA video stuff would be awesome....those are here about somewhere....I can't find em.

ok post 100 goes to this little pet's author...

In fairness I just found some video tips from PSIA on the website....

A couple are pretty cool....the skiing switch vid is rad..

Finally some free stuff from the good 'ol USA!!!

http://www.thesnowpros.org/index.php/PSIA-AASI/video-gallery/

Enjoy newbies!!

In closing for tonight I would like to speak directly to newbie visitors to this thread.....kinda along the lines of Pete's comment above.....

-Learn early in your ski career to have an open mind.....this thread is a good example. There are many solid tips and tidbits here but please remember, all of it need not work for YOU!  My tips tend to be visual in nature, that is how I learn. Words and ski books talking about skiing, it doesn't work for me. Visual stuff may not work for you. So digest it all, try what looks good to you and throw everything that doesn't out. Our fabulous sport of recreational skiing is about fun!!  Arguments and posturing, we have enough of that in our daily life. Our great sport is truly one of life's greatest pleasures. Trust me, when you can do it at above the intermediate level it is truly like flying. You will be hard pressed to find any activity as exciting and rewarding as recreational alpine skiing.

-So work hard to get better. Read everything you can about skiing. Look at video, click on the links in this thread and ask for and hunt for more. Watch Greg Stump and Warren Miller, Lito Tejada Flores and TGR videos.....devour it all. Learn about ski gear, what different types of skis can do to supercharge your skiing. Demo, demo demo gear and then demo some more.

-Ski forums on the internet....there are many(I think Epic is the best) but others are good too, sign up ask questions and discuss our great sport. If you get flamed put "em on ignore and move on. When you feel like firing back at a sarcastic or mean spirited post....walk away from the keyboard. That will protect you. You can learn a lot about our sport from a place like this.....tread carefully but without fear. It is all for you.

-It is incredible to believe that people argue about skiing......tipping, steering, hopping, rotary blah blah blah ......but know this my beginner friends.....I have never had an argument about skiing on the hill. I taught for 10 years and have ski'd since I was a baby. Not one argument....never. I personally have always considered anyone on the hill with a smile on their face to be an expert regardless of how they ski. If you are smiling you are my friend.

Enjoy and welcome!

Now all the rest of us let's get to work and get those free ski tips coming!!!!

Some good and sincere words from HRstrat57.

 

Let me add something I saw today at Lookout Pass Ski Area which is located on the Idaho-Montana border Hwy 90.  Today was 1" of fresh snow on hard pack.  Under chair 2 on the back side is a black diamong rated slope with icy moguls and a double fall line (this is a fall line that goes down hill 2 ways, i.e., straight down and at the same side off to the side and down).  These conditions and the slope made this a difficult run for even a very accomplished skier.

 

While riding the chair we (Mountaingoat and I) observed 4 beginner skiers heading down the run.  We both comment, ugh this is not going to be nice.  We both wondered what are these people doing here?  As we were watching 1 skier did a 360 and fell, 1 skier sat down and plunked, 1 stopped and the other sat down.   Approximately 20 min later we took that chair again and the 4 people were 1/2 way down and in the following status:   1 flat on her stomach with 1 ski on and no poles,  1 trying to crawl up the hill to get the lst ones poles and ski, 1 laying face down with both skis off and 1 sliding down the hill holding her skis and skidding on her butt.  To say these 4 bit off more than they could chew would be an understatement.

The real Question is  WHY.   Skiing is to have fun and enjoy yourself.   Challenge yourself in increments, small increments.  Watch where you are  and where you are headed you don't want to do to yourself what was described in the above paragraph.  If a "friend" says "oh, you can ski this", ask yourself; have you seen this run before, can you see it now, have you seen it on a trailmap, or from the chair and maybe most importantly can you trust this friend?

Skiing is an adventure but you don't start out Mountin Climbing by doing Everest, Ranier or McKinley as your lst climb.  Have fun, grow, learn and smell the pines, make some life long friends and have some accomplishments and thrills.  Don't start out as the above 4 or you may abandon this great sport and lifestyle prematurely.

I haven't read the previous 100+ posts, so apologies if I repeat what has already been said.  I was a brand new, never before, skier just three years ago, so I can identify with what beginners are going through. 

THE most important thing, IMO, is -- drumroll -- knowing how to stop.  Not that you will need to, or should, stop on the slopes, but you will eventually need to stop at the lift line or base lodge.  Knowing how to stop of your own volition -- other than the obvious way, ditching -- will give you a lot of confidence.  Others may blast me for oversimplifying, but there are essentially two ways to stop: (1) turn uphill; (2) do a "hockey stop" (i.e., turn hard and dig your edges into the snow).  That's it.   

   

 If this thread hadn't been created, we would have had to! Thank you all.



I just joined to ask for advice to deal with cold painful fingertips and toes in 20 degrees weather without using the hand/ toes warmer packs (treating the idea as a last resort).

1) My wife and I both have North Face gloves but our finger tips are always so cold it's really painful after a few hours of skiing. Is this "normal"?
I look around and the teenagers and everyone else are moving around and behaving like it isn't even cold.


2) Same for the toes.
At first we used North Face skiing socks.
Subsequently, we bought one pair of super thin base layer socks and one pair of ski socks from Columbia. Layering helped a bit but after a few hours our toes were painful.

This goes against the advice of some on here saying not to wear two pairs of socks to allow the best boot fit. Or did they mean two pairs of regular ski socks? Base Layer socks + ski socks are ok, right?

I hope this adds helpful content to the thread since I haven't seen it covered yet.

Edited by refill - 2/10/10 at 3:42pm

First, gloves.  Not familiar with NF gloves but am familiar with skiing in cold weather. There are some very good gloves out there so you have to ask and look around for really warm gloves.  My wife has cold hands and uses the Hestra 3 fingered glove/mitten with the insert place for handwarmers, which she uses.

2 pairs of any kind of socks makes for a very poor fit and may be adding to you pain.  Cold feet can be many things; ill fitting boots, crummy boots that are just not insulated properly, you are standing around too much and not moving, your socks aren't warm ones or all  of the above.  I had Nordica boots that were always cold so I always wore the Toe Warmers that adhesive to your sock right above your toes.  Have new boots now and haven't used toe warmers this year.

Go to a good ski shop and talk to someone who knows their business and get some advice.  May be a good time to chose a local ski shop and become a customer.

-
Edited by refill - 2/11/10 at 7:30am

So you managed to rid yourself of cold fingertips and toes problem?

So it is possible then = I am doing something wrong.

The boots are rentals: they may not be entirely dry, (melted) snow may enter the boots while skiing, the fit isn't good enough etc. One of those or a combination.

Gloves: I read that mittens are warmer than gloves. We may have the wrong ones even after spending $70 each on ours.



You are right.

I would like to but I am reading terrible feedback about Paragon Sports (I am in Manhattan). In fact that where I was advised to layer-up the socks: the Columbia thin layer socks (moisture whisking properties etc.) and the ski (wool blend) Columbia socks on top of that. I guess they wanted to make a sale and I didn't know better.

Was going to go to Ski Barn on Rt.17 in NJ.

Notice the recurring "wear a helmet" theme here - do it. Not only for the safety factor (www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/Movies/03/18/obit.richardson/index.html), and my wife suffered a concussion the same exact way - but you will actually be warmer believe it or not...

If you are wearing glasses - put your helmet and goggles on before leaving the lodge to avoid them fogging up immediately when they hit the freezing air outside (especially those of us who are blind without them).

Don't get so involved talking about that last awesome run to your friends in the chair behind you that you don't get off the lift at the top! Avoids embarrassment all around...

You are on the slopes for the first time (ever or this year), and will be using muscles that you didn't know or remember exist - take it easy and remember to take some time at the top of the lift (off the main trail!) and look at the beauty before you. For rookies or occasional skiers like me, high speed  lifts go so fast your thighs are still burning when you get back to the top - like was said before: fatigue = injury.

I'm still a beginner, and had a great experience at EMS on Broadway and Spring last week. We worked with the manager, who was specifically not on commission, and he was very, very helpful. You may want to take a look there. He even recommended some non-EMS websites that may have better deals than they had.

 Thank you very much for the tip: I never knew about them. I'll go. 

Going back to Windham tomorrow Sat! 

Refill,   forgot something.  Used to drive 1 1/2 hrs up to Tahoe, wore my ski socks in my regular shoes etc.   Trouble.  My feet would get warm in the car on the way up and would perspire just a little.  then I got to the Mt. and put my slightly wet feet into a ski boot.  result cold feet, cold boots etc.

Heres what I do now (every time I ski).

Make sure my boots are dry (have a small evaporative blower made just for ski boots-drys them really well without heating boot.
Put my boots in the back seat in my truck, put the 12volt heaters down inside the boot in toe area and leave on for my drive up to the hill (average time 55 min).  I have a pair of after ski type Technica boots I wear up with regular socks.

When I arrive and boot up.  Take my street socks off and put my ski socks on (put the socks one in the top of each boot while the warmer is inside-traps the warm air and sock doesn't get cold either) boot up and go.  On really cold days I will use the Toe Warmers, they have adhesive on one side and you put almost right over toes on top of foot, carefully slide into boots so you don't dislodge.

Hope this helps.  I ski in some really cold weather and this system works for me.  If you are renting boots then you obviously have even another problem.  Try:  putting your hand in the boots and see if they're wet or cold, or both if so ask for a dry warmer boot.  Or maybe get your own boots.

 Thanks Pete.

You know, you are 100% correct and I hadn't thought about it: I wear my ski socks for the drive to skiing too and it's a 3 hours drive. I kinda wanted to arrive ready to boot-up and go.
Your method/ recommendation is wise and practical and will do that tomorrow.

Great tip. I am sure this help many.


Buying boots: I ordered our first pair for my wife and I this week from Back-Country.
I know the web is NOT how you buy boots.
But they both are Head EDGE+ 11 and they were on sale (hers: $250 and mine $160 after Bing cash back).
They didn't get here on time for tomorrow but for me this is a try-out.
I plan on visiting a ski shop with them and seek their help to fit them (heat moldable isn't it what it's called?). Or I'll just return them if they are not right for us and buy from the shop then.

I was told resorts stop making snow in the second week of March. Don't know whether this is correct but that doesn't leave a lot of ski time (I can only go on week-ends).

Side note: I looked up the ski levels for the first time yesterday and was very happy to see that we are a Level 4 (we thought we were level 2)! 


Edited by refill - 2/12/10 at 7:22pm

Refill,  buying boots from Backcountry may work for you, just remember before you "fiddle" with them too much that they have a 100% return policy.

several year ago I had them send me two different boots, Atomic and Nordica.  I wore them around the living room for a total of about 2 hours, comparing, taking off, switching etc., sent the Atomics back and kept and skied the Nordicas for 4 years.  Good luck. Wear them, flex them etc.

Glad I could help, have a great time, hopfully with warmer feet.   My Best from Northern Idaho

When walking with your poles, consider them scissors, Hold them as such with the points down. Do not swing them behind you and don't carry them points up.  Avoid taking out someone's (even a child's) eye.

If you have had your boots warmed up to "custom fit" in the store, as most boots have a heat moldable feature these days, remember that if you put them near a warm source, heater, warm air outlet or in a furnace room, you may have denatured them so put them on when still warm to remold them.   If you forget to do this just pop into any shop near the hill and ask to use their warmer. It will take only 10 minutes or so to warm them up and off you go!

Consider getting one of the products on the market that save the bottom of your boots. Cat Tracks is one.  They facilitate easy walking and save wear and tear on the bottom of your boots.  This wear can have an impact on your performance if too much, aand on your safety.

Zip up your coat.

Wear a helmet.  Consider getting a mouthguard too.
Learn how to correctly put on your pole straps.   Take them off every time you get on the chair.
Cover your eyes with goggles or good sunglasses.  (Protect from sun/ UV light etc.)
Buckle your boots snugly. 

Inspect the bottom of your skis after each ski day for wear or base hits, especially near the edges.

Get a footbed.

Don't use antiquated equipment.  At least make sure your bindings are okay.

EJL

Hey Pete,

Feet were warmer and didn't get cold until the end of the day, 30-40 mns before we were to leave. When I removed my ski socks (changed back to another pair for the drive home), I found a little bit of moisture around my toes, proof that moisture is what makes the toes feel like they are burning/ turning into ice. 

I should get our boots today and was also planning on wearing at home for a few hours (how else would you know what they feel like otherwise).

Windham was ok on Sat. Lost of icy parts on both their Green and Blue trails. I was annoyed.
Also, I fell 4 times on one of their Blue trails. At the spot each time, this really steep bump. I could not get my left leg to obey to turn right. I'd end-up going straight since I could not go right-left-right to slow down. The more I went straight, the less able I was to force a turn to slow down. It sapped my moral since this started right away: on my third run after getting there.

We ended-up going back to the green trails and I had 0 problems there the rest of our time.

All in all, it was a great day though. We skied from 2:30 to 8:30 pm.

Perhaps I am not Level 4 after all. I am thinking of taking a lesson next week: going back on Sat. 



TIP: we get the Sunset lift tickets (ski from 2 to 9 pm) from www.liftopia.com at a discounted price.

Nice to hear the Epic Tips section is working.  Warmer feet are a real plus.  As a beginner you did the right thing, having real problems and frustrations move back to known terrain.  Also it is good for you to know:  injuries occur more frequently at the end of the day when the skier is tired and/or just worn out.  Scaling back to easier terrain at the end of the day is a very smart thing to do.  My strongest time skiing is just before lunch , say 10:30 to noon, this is usually when I try to ski the hardest terrain or that new gnarly line never at the end of the day.

Nice to hear you are having fun and enjoying yourselves.

Don't hang your wet gloves from the light fitting, they may start smoking

    You don't happen to be a firefighter I used to ski and race with in tahoe?