Any ideas on an all-mountain ski?

Hey guys...I'm new to post in this forum but I've been reading it for a few weeks now and love it. I'm in the process of looking for a new set of skis. I'm 5' 9" and 170 lbs, 27 years old. I'm a expert skier (can ski anything on the mountain except for maybe a little tentative on some difficult shoots and steep trees). I tend to stay off-piste (trees, light powdered bumps and steeps).. I live in Chicago currently and get out West a couple times a year. I want to get an all-mountain setup right now b/c I can't justify buying a few different setups until i move out west (should happen someday.) Since I do live in the Midwest though, I have to deal with the hardpack and icy slopes around here so I don't want a ski that's going to chatter a ton and slip-and-slide all over the place when I do go local. I've been looking at the K2 Outlaws, Volkl AC4s and the Rossignol B3s. I've read so-so reviews of the K2s, the AC4s have been getting mostly positive feedback and I haven't heard much of the B3s. I'm probably looking at a length of 170 (AC4) and 174 (K2s) and not sure about the B3s. You guys have any recommendations? Any other skis I should look at. I should really try and demo a pair but I can't b/c there really is nowhere to do so around here.

BHall, i'm about your height/weight and age. I just got the Nordica Jet Fuel's after testing the outlaws, AC4, b3's, head mojo's and several others. This was by far my favorite ski, its 84 underfoot, but still really quick. i found it to be a lot more lively than the AC4, which just seemed too hefty. The Jet Fuel has great edge hold and pretty darn good float. And ya i would go with the 170. Let me know if you have any more questions.

I'm 5'8" 190 lbs and have some 165 cm Salomon Scrambler all mountain skis 123/75/110. They work good here in the south east unless the conditions are really bad. Being a expert you may want a stiffer ski but after demoing some skis myself I dont think a ski with a 80 mm + waist is the way to go and our conditions are pretty close to what you guys have.

Advise from a fellow midwesterner (minnesota)

Bite the bullet and have one ski for the slopes near Chi town and another pair for the west. (especially if you are looking for the steep and deep) Read these posts to get some ideas and look for an older wide (waist closer to 90 mm) for cheap on ebay.

I am 180 lbs 6 ft and ski a 161 Volkl supersport (TR/slide cut = 13m) locally. The short hills make this ski a blast.

I ski a 180 Volkl Explosive (95 mm waist) when I go west. Got them for $200 at a local ski swap. (In fact I usually drag both pair with me - I have seen some hard snow in the west too)

Last thought -- Shame on all you out their with those huge quivers, they could be on the market for cheap, that way I could buy them.

I'll second the Jet Fuel as I'm on it on my non-deep days. I'm also 5'9" 170 but ski the 186. If I skied on hard snow often I would be wishing for shorter. But in soft snow/crud/groomers they fricking rip.

If your local hill is man-made hard snow, consider shorter or even narrower than 84 underfoot. (although Nordica's hot rod line is wood/sidewall= stable and very fun even on firmer snow compared to other midfats.) honestly, Nordica really busted out some nice mid-fats this season. I'm shocked at how well they hold.

But I also like Skugrud's idea about ebaying an older fat ski for your western trips. Fat skis from 3 years ago are still really fun in deep snow. and nothing beats a quiver...

I just think the Jet Fuel is a REALLY solid one-ski quiver choice that will do its duty on firmer snow more than other mids. Don't be afraid to go a little longer... they whirl...

I was in the All-Mountain market and ended up with Elan's Magfire 10. I have not skied them yet, however, after searching for feedback on this ski it became clear it would be an excellent all-mountain ski with great edge hold, good snow contact, and an energy builder out of the turn. And stable at speed. I love the graphics and after pricing some of the other ski's, it's a great value. Less $$$ than most.

Check 'em out.

I have demoed the B3 and would not recommend it for anything but soft conditions. It was ok on farily soft groomed snow (really good in crud and powder), but it was just ok. I couldn't see it being really useful in the Mid-West for on piste. I have not skied the AC4, but I have a friend who did (and who skis both out West and in the East) and he loved them for everything. Of the three skis you listed, the AC4 sounds like it would be the most versatile. Just as a point of comparison, I ended up getting the Dynastar Big Trouble because of how versatile it is out West. I found it to be much more useful in a wide variety of conditions than the B3.

I think what I'm going to do is go with the Jet Fuel or the AC4s. To me it seems like splitting hairs when deciding between these two skis...the dimensions are nearly identical, 126-84-112 for the Jet Fuel and 125-82-110 for the AC4. Enough underfoot to allow for some floatation in pow. That and they seem to respond pretty identical to the conditions, while they both rip in shallow pow, bumps, trees and clean corduroy they also both hold edges in hard pack and ice. Furthermore, they even can do alright in the deep stuff, not great but not enough to keep you in the lodge drinking Irish coffee all day looking at the snow bunnies, while fun I'd rather do that at night after ripping all day. I'll probably eBay an older fattie setup (like you guys mentioned) just to have something to fall back on in case a big dump comes along on a trip out West. I do remember back in March of '03 during the snowstorm of the century when I luckily was trapped in Breckenridge during spring break and was ripping with my Volkl P30s, so I know I can get it done with the race skis in the deep stuff. However, my quads were shot by the end of the day trying to keep those damn things afloat. Fun though. In terms of length, I'll probably go with the 177 since I think I can get away with it b/c of my age and ability. I can't justify going with the 170 when I'll be skiing 50% West and 50% Midwest. The only problem with these two skiis, Jet Fuel and AC4, is they are both a cool $1000. Ugh...I guess you get what you pay for.

You might also want to take a look at the Afterburner. I skied both the Jet Fuel and the Afterburner, and felt the latter took the fun level up a bit since it was more lively. It's going to depend on the feel you like, of course, but when Noodler, Faisasy, and I were demoing, we all felt that the Afterburner was closer in feel to the AC4, and at least one of us (me) gave it the edge. You can find our reviews of them over on the review forum.

1) Buy a $20 subscription to Peter Keelty's http://www.techsupportforskiers.com/ subscription web site. His reviews are the best I've seen, and he answers individual questions about equipment and other skiing topics.

2) Give serious consideration to a narrow waist, wide tip & tail ski. I really like my Head Supershape skis on everything from ice to fresh snow up to a foot deep. It is the best all-mountain ski I know of. The skis that go by that name are usually more of a compromise on packed snow than I like due to their wide waist; I'd suggest looking at skis no more than 72 mm wide in the waist. For your size and weight, the 165 cm Supershape would be right. For someone your size, the 170 would be OK for a very hard charger. This is Peter's one-ski-quiver choice. He says, "If you have well developed modern technical skills and spend most of the time on groomed, with some off-piste travel, this just might be the best ski ever made for you. Most shop testers found it challenging; our professional skiers absolutely love the Supershape. Be sure to test this one first if in any doubt. Great SR turns, holds well in 20m turns, wide tip even floats in the deep. Good Masters slalom choice." Peter lists several other possible one-ski-quiver choices from other brands, depending on the skier's ability and skiing style. Look at all the "all mountain carvers" you can locate...Atomic B5, Dynastar Contact 11, Elan Magfire 12, Nordica Speed Machine Mach III, Rossi Z9, Stockli Rotor, Volkl Supersport Allstar are also interesting choices.

3) Combine #1 and #2. Use Peter's reviews and his answers to your questions to formulate a demo list, then demo as many as you can get on to. There is no substitute for demoing a ski before you buy to find which is the right ski for you.


Ken